A Little Thing About Frank Mir

MegasoupMegasoup Maker of SoupsPosts: 2,386Free
Alright, full disclosure: I'm not really a fan, nor am I a critic. I like any fight he's in though. He's exciting and you know it. Anyway,I have compiled a small sampling of Heavyweights who are known for their ground game, whether it be wrestling or submission, and put their numbers of takedowns, passes and submissions next to them. I think the relationship between these two numbers (as racked up within the body of each respective fighters career in the UFC) is relevant and I'll explain why, in case it's not clear. This isn't a score based on the volume of takedowns or passes, more the likelihood that afighter can turn these into fight-ending submissions.



Brock Lesnar TD 11 Passes 14 Submissions 2

Cain Velasques TD 27 Passes 27 Submissions 2

Big Nog TD 7 Passes 16 Submissions 10

Josh Barnett TD 4 Passes 10 Submissions 4

Frank Mir TD 19 Passes 22 Submissions 20



Discuss.




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  • classicboxerclassicboxer Posts: 11,823Free
    Megasoup said:

    Alright, full disclosure: I'm not really a fan, nor am I a critic. I like any fight he's in though. He's exciting and you know it. Anyway,I have compiled a small sampling of Heavyweights who are known for their ground game, whether it be wrestling or submission, and put their numbers of takedowns, passes and submissions next to them. I think the relationship between these two numbers (as racked up within the body of each respective fighters career in the UFC) is relevant and I'll explain why, in case it's not clear. This isn't a score based on the volume of takedowns or passes, more the likelihood that afighter can turn these into fight-ending submissions.



    Brock Lesnar TD 11 Passes 14 Submissions 2

    Cain Velasques TD 27 Passes 27 Submissions 2

    Big Nog TD 7 Passes 16 Submissions 10

    Josh Barnett TD 4 Passes 10 Submissions 4

    Frank Mir TD 19 Passes 22 Submissions 20



    Discuss.




    I've always been a fan of Mir's submissions. However, after the first Big Nog fight, Mir thought he was a skilled boxer, which is false.
    Oakland, CA: Raiders, A's, Warriors
  • MegasoupMegasoup Maker of SoupsPosts: 2,386Free

    Megasoup said:

    Alright, full disclosure: I'm not really a fan, nor am I a critic. I like any fight he's in though. He's exciting and you know it. Anyway,I have compiled a small sampling of Heavyweights who are known for their ground game, whether it be wrestling or submission, and put their numbers of takedowns, passes and submissions next to them. I think the relationship between these two numbers (as racked up within the body of each respective fighters career in the UFC) is relevant and I'll explain why, in case it's not clear. This isn't a score based on the volume of takedowns or passes, more the likelihood that afighter can turn these into fight-ending submissions.



    Brock Lesnar TD 11 Passes 14 Submissions 2

    Cain Velasques TD 27 Passes 27 Submissions 2

    Big Nog TD 7 Passes 16 Submissions 10

    Josh Barnett TD 4 Passes 10 Submissions 4

    Frank Mir TD 19 Passes 22 Submissions 20



    Discuss.




    I've always been a fan of Mir's submissions. However, after the first Big Nog fight, Mir thought he was a skilled boxer, which is false.
    Oh, he's not that bad! Especially for MMA. I'm sure you know how it's extremely difficult to apply boxing technique, because it requires a lot of gifts in areas that are doggone impossible to work on. Thing's like reflexes and speed are hopelessly impossible to "develop," and agility and timing are not much easier to improve upon. We all know the sad story of knockout power (fortunately for Mir, he seems to have it.) What you're left with is just practicing good, basic fundamentals, like keeping your hands up and circling out after throwing a combination; setting things up with the jab. Mir does these things.
    Member of the People's Freedom Movement


  • wanderleisilva101wanderleisilva101 Posts: 9,414Free
    Are these sub attempts you're talking about? I'm still not sure what this proves Mir has fought in the ufc since his 3rd fight that's 20 fights of course he has better numbers than Nog or Barnett they have had far less fights include pride stats and Cain and Brock hardly ever look for submissions they use passes to set up ground and pound. :-??
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  • MegasoupMegasoup Maker of SoupsPosts: 2,386Free
    I did say to not look at the numbers as scores, but more the relationship between takedowns or passes and actual submissions. Mir has a much higher percentage rate of finishing guys with a submission once the fight hits the ground. An extreme example is Cain's 27 guard passes versus his 2 submissions. Not a very good finisher (at least, by submission.) Mir, by contrast, has 22 passes which resulted in 20 submissions, which means that if he passes your guard, you're almost invariably getting tapped out.
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  • jdukjduk Posts: 8,285Free
    What are you talking about with these numbers? Mir has 22 total fights, with 9 sub wins, so everything you've said is wrong. These numbers do not tell the story of a fight.
    image
  • classicboxerclassicboxer Posts: 11,823Free
    Megasoup said:

    Megasoup said:

    Alright, full disclosure: I'm not really a fan, nor am I a critic. I like any fight he's in though. He's exciting and you know it. Anyway,I have compiled a small sampling of Heavyweights who are known for their ground game, whether it be wrestling or submission, and put their numbers of takedowns, passes and submissions next to them. I think the relationship between these two numbers (as racked up within the body of each respective fighters career in the UFC) is relevant and I'll explain why, in case it's not clear. This isn't a score based on the volume of takedowns or passes, more the likelihood that afighter can turn these into fight-ending submissions.



    Brock Lesnar TD 11 Passes 14 Submissions 2

    Cain Velasques TD 27 Passes 27 Submissions 2

    Big Nog TD 7 Passes 16 Submissions 10

    Josh Barnett TD 4 Passes 10 Submissions 4

    Frank Mir TD 19 Passes 22 Submissions 20



    Discuss.




    I've always been a fan of Mir's submissions. However, after the first Big Nog fight, Mir thought he was a skilled boxer, which is false.
    Oh, he's not that bad! Especially for MMA. I'm sure you know how it's extremely difficult to apply boxing technique, because it requires a lot of gifts in areas that are doggone impossible to work on. Thing's like reflexes and speed are hopelessly impossible to "develop," and agility and timing are not much easier to improve upon. We all know the sad story of knockout power (fortunately for Mir, he seems to have it.) What you're left with is just practicing good, basic fundamentals, like keeping your hands up and circling out after throwing a combination; setting things up with the jab. Mir does these things.
    He just seems to be very robotic and slow. I know boxing doesn't really work in MMA, but Mir just doesn't impress me at all when it comes to stand up.
    Oakland, CA: Raiders, A's, Warriors
  • PunchBagPunchBag Posts: 7,846Free
    edited February 2013
    mir has good submissions but poor wrestling. if he can get the fight to the ground then theres a good chance of submission but more often than not he cant
    Post edited by PunchBag on
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  • Little_KangLittle_Kang Posts: 17,802Moderator, Ultimate
    PunchBag said:

    mir has good submissions but poor wrestling. if he can get the fight to the ground then theres a good chance of submission but more often than not he cant

    yeah taking down wes sims and tank abotts really show how skilled he is
    imageimage
    image
  • MegasoupMegasoup Maker of SoupsPosts: 2,386Free
    jduk said:

    What are you talking about with these numbers? Mir has 22 total fights, with 9 sub wins, so everything you've said is wrong. These numbers do not tell the story of a fight.

    Funny, I got these numbers from the fighter profiles on UFC's website, but you're correct. Maybe it's supposed to be "sub attempts"...but it's listed simply as "submissions." I claim no fault for my error; I went with what should have been reliable information. Pardon me, though.
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  • najmanajma Posts: 2,062Free
    Lesnar: 100 fights against great fighters/former champs, 99% wins
    Mir: 100 fights against bums with no ground game, 70% wins

    Yeah, it's great comparing them.
    image
  • jdukjduk Posts: 8,285Free
    Megasoup said:

    jduk said:

    What are you talking about with these numbers? Mir has 22 total fights, with 9 sub wins, so everything you've said is wrong. These numbers do not tell the story of a fight.

    Funny, I got these numbers from the fighter profiles on UFC's website, but you're correct. Maybe it's supposed to be "sub attempts"...but it's listed simply as "submissions." I claim no fault for my error; I went with what should have been reliable information. Pardon me, though.
    NEVER believe anything the UFC tells you, rookie error right there
    image
  • KOOKORKKOOKORK Posts: 779Free
    jduk said:

    Megasoup said:

    jduk said:

    What are you talking about with these numbers? Mir has 22 total fights, with 9 sub wins, so everything you've said is wrong. These numbers do not tell the story of a fight.

    Funny, I got these numbers from the fighter profiles on UFC's website, but you're correct. Maybe it's supposed to be "sub attempts"...but it's listed simply as "submissions." I claim no fault for my error; I went with what should have been reliable information. Pardon me, though.
    NEVER believe anything the UFC tells you, rookie error right there
    This is too pessimistic. Never is too much word in MMA.
    It is not about win or lose, it is about heart. Leave all you have in the Octagon and you are a winner in my book.
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  • WarWestWarWest Órale VatoPosts: 33,764Free
    He's Amazin' ??
    The Cal Ripken Of GSP hatin'
    Arch Bishop Of Anti-GSP
    The Stockton Hater
    209's So Fine
  • jdukjduk Posts: 8,285Free
    WarWest said:

    He's Amazin' ??

    inb4Sobercuban
    image
  • classicboxerclassicboxer Posts: 11,823Free
    najma said:

    Lesnar: 100 fights against great fighters/former champs, 99% wins
    Mir: 100 fights against bums with no ground game, 70% wins


    Yeah, it's great comparing them.

    Lesnar was 5-3, 62.5%
    Oakland, CA: Raiders, A's, Warriors
  • sobercorruptsobercorrupt Sobercorrupt Posts: 25,780Moderator, Ultimate
    jduk said:

    WarWest said:

    He's Amazin' ??

    inb4Sobercuban

    ^this
    imageimageimageimageimage < -- click one

    I am an idiot for thinking GSP could finish the P4P GOAT Nick Diaz within 5 rounds
  • zaksamezaksame Posts: 4,342Free
    The numbers like all stats are missing a key point >>>opponents.Stats can never tell you what your own eyes already see,stats are for bookies and gambling.
    The HW division is and always has been just awful,i really don't care who wins one fight to the next.When you have a large circle of very mediocre fighters,anything can happen.
    Tim Sylvia was a champ in the UFC,Brock walked right in from a circus side show and became champ very quickly.That same Brock also went out rather quickly,he looked terrible versus Reem who in turn looked bad to a rather average Bigfoot.A really bad division where numbers mean nothing.
    Gina Miesha Kyra ...yes please.
  • jdukjduk Posts: 8,285Free
    zaksame said:

    The numbers like all stats are missing a key point >>>opponents.Stats can never tell you what your own eyes already see,stats are for bookies and gambling.
    The HW division is and always has been just awful,i really don't care who wins one fight to the next.When you have a large circle of very mediocre fighters,anything can happen.
    Tim Sylvia was a champ in the UFC,Brock walked right in from a circus side show and became champ very quickly.That same Brock also went out rather quickly,he looked terrible versus Reem who in turn looked bad to a rather average Bigfoot.A really bad division where numbers mean nothing.

    I don't even know if you're serious
    image
  • waikruwaikru UFC PresidentPosts: 10,004Free
    I always liked Mir. I think he just needs to focus on improving his takedowns to get back in the title mix.
    On November 16th Hendricks became the real undisputed champion.

    "Believe in the beard"

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  • PunchBagPunchBag Posts: 7,846Free
    if he looses he might get cut
    "Believe in the beard"
    I bet against THE KING and he smashed my little gonads into oblivion
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