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0311USMC

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Arlov is correct. I feel Rua was robbed. Its fairly clear that Rua won the fight. I gave Rua a 48/47 Decision which was being nice by giving him a round that was close.

 

agreed. i felt with the current scoring system that machida only won one round maybe two. i have watched the fight 3 times now with an open mind and come to the same conclusion everytime.

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I knew what JJW and G_Row thought. I'd like to hear where Brewster stands.

 

Superbeast41 too but he doesn't seem to post anymore.

 

Who are these Leonie and defsteve cats? I never see them post at all EVER.

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I knew what JJW and G_Row thought. I'd like to hear where Brewster stands.

 

Superbeast41 too but he doesn't seem to post anymore.

 

Who are these Leonie and defsteve cats? I never see them post at all EVER.

 

I have seen them post, not very often but they do live.

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I knew what JJW and G_Row thought. I'd like to hear where Brewster stands.

 

Superbeast41 too but he doesn't seem to post anymore.

 

Who are these Leonie and defsteve cats? I never see them post at all EVER.

 

Superbeast is dealing with some personal issues and won't be around for a while.

 

Def Steve does a lot of work behind the scenes. He posts, but not very often

 

Leonie is an Admin for the UFC site and pretty much the Boss. She takes care of most issues for the site. She also posts and but not often. She is a pretty busy person

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Brewster! The pressure's on. After watching the fight back - I think I score it differently. I think the Machida round 1 is clearer than I first imagined, though I did feel he won initially. Round 2 and 3 are up in the air and I feel that Rua did win at least one of the 2. Originally I thought 2, on retrospect I think 3 maybe. About a minute into the 3rd Machida's straight left counters hold no power in comparison to Rua's strikes and is obvious in the last 2 giving Rua the last 2 rounds easily. I do believe there is a power difference from the 3rd onwards that must matter n the fight.

 

Concluding - unhappy with Machida win, though the fight is close. Rua wins 29-28 like I originally thought, but points aside from round 3 onward there is a clear winner still IMO.

Do agree that it's maybe too technical for me to judge at first (even second) glance.

Hard to take into account top and bottom strikes at all times.

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Watching the fight live I felt Rua had won the fight clearly. Since then I have not re-watched it, so perhaps if I were to, my perception may change.

 

I personally however, do not care either way who won or lost... the fight, to me, was a good one, and even if I feel a fighter may win or lose a decision based on bad judging or a bad call by a referee, that is the nature of the beast. We love a sport that is judged and refereed based purely on human perception. Every single person saw something different in that and every fight and we can argue a stoppage or decision until the cows come home.

 

I love that human side of the sport. Is it perfect? no, but this isn't point karate, this isn't Olympic boxing. This sport is young and needs to eventually have the way we score a bout changed. That will come in time, I believe that... it's the fastest growing sport in the world.

 

Enjoy the fights as they are, accept the good calls with the bad, we are human after all, everyone will see an event differently than the person sitting beside them.

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Watching the fight live I felt Rua had won the fight clearly. Since then I have not re-watched it' date=' so perhaps if I were to, my perception may change.

 

I personally however, do not care either way who won or lost... the fight, to me, was a good one, and even if I feel a fighter may win or lose a decision based on bad judging or a bad call by a referee, that is the nature of the beast. We love a sport that is judged and refereed based purely on human perception. Every single person saw something different in that and every fight and we can argue a stoppage or decision until the cows come home.

 

I love that human side of the sport. Is it perfect? no, but this isn't point karate, this isn't Olympic boxing. This sport is young and needs to eventually have the way we score a bout changed. That will come in time, I believe that... it's the fastest growing sport in the world.

 

Enjoy the fights as they are, accept the good calls with the bad, we are human after all, everyone will see an event differently than the person sitting beside them.[/quote']

 

I agree that humans do make mistakes, so my next question would be: How is it that 3 judges made the same mistake?

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That my friend is your opinion. In the opinion of the 3 judges who were sitting at ringside' date=' they simply saw it different than you... or most in this case.[/quote']

 

Actually the best view is sitting home watching it on TV isn't it? Dont have to look through the fencing on the cage and we HAVE a lot better angles and close-ups.

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That is why judges sit on different sides of the Octagon, so they all don't see the same thing, which is often why we see different scores on score cards.

 

Having judging take place by video monitor would mean each judge would see the exact same thing and would be reliant on the angle seen by the camera, which perhaps isn't always the best, or may pan or change angles to a different camera and have the judges possibly miss something.

 

At live events Goldie does his commentating from a monitor, Joe watches the fights (FYI)

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Watching the fight live I felt Rua had won the fight clearly. Since then I have not re-watched it' date=' so perhaps if I were to, my perception may change.

 

I personally however, do not care either way who won or lost... the fight, to me, was a good one, and even if I feel a fighter may win or lose a decision based on bad judging or a bad call by a referee, that is the nature of the beast. We love a sport that is judged and refereed based purely on human perception. Every single person saw something different in that and every fight and we can argue a stoppage or decision until the cows come home.

 

I love that human side of the sport. Is it perfect? no, but this isn't point karate, this isn't Olympic boxing. This sport is young and needs to eventually have the way we score a bout changed. That will come in time, I believe that... it's the fastest growing sport in the world.

 

Enjoy the fights as they are, accept the good calls with the bad, we are human after all, everyone will see an event differently than the person sitting beside them.[/quote']

 

Holy sheet! That was a fair and unbiased comment and I LOVE it!!!!! Honestly I didn't expect it, but I have gained a new respect for Brew. Not that I didn't respect his views before, but this just went against everything I thought he would do. Friggin A!!!!

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I knew what JJW and G_Row thought. I'd like to hear where Brewster stands.

 

Superbeast41 too but he doesn't seem to post anymore.

 

Who are these Leonie and defsteve cats? I never see them post at all EVER.

 

Leonie is on here every day.

Defsteve is over at the fight club more then here, but does show up now and again.

I think Machida won the first three rounds. It was close and neither did that much, but Machida takes it.

I also do not see what all the fuss is about. It was a close fight, sure, but Shogun did not deserve the win.

Every time Rogan was saying stuff about a leg kick, he failed to mention the punch that Machida landed. Shogun had no flurries, Machida did. Shogun tried a couple take downs and was unsuccessful.

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I'm just being honest.

 

LOL, if you think I am doing that, I must say that it is not the case.

I have seen my share of decisions that I totally disagree with. Leben vs Starnes. Hughes Serra. Hamill Bisping.

This fight was no where near those in my opinion.

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Leonie is on here every day.

Defsteve is over at the fight club more then here' date=' but does show up now and again.

I think Machida won the first three rounds. It was close and neither did that much, but Machida takes it.

I also do not see what all the fuss is about. It was a close fight, sure, but Shogun did not deserve the win.

Every time Rogan was saying stuff about a leg kick, he failed to mention the punch that Machida landed. Shogun had no flurries, Machida did. Shogun tried a couple take downs and was unsuccessful.[/quote']

 

i didnt have to bother Leonie this time for my fantasy prizes becuz they came on time. q; D , Leonie is always helpful with answering questions.

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i didnt have to bother Leonie this time for my fantasy prizes becuz they came on time. q; D ' date=' Leonie is always helpful with answering questions.[/quote']

 

You're such a liar.

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Leonie is on here every day.

Defsteve is over at the fight club more then here' date=' but does show up now and again.

I think Machida won the first three rounds. It was close and neither did that much, but Machida takes it.

I also do not see what all the fuss is about. It was a close fight, sure, but Shogun did not deserve the win.

Every time Rogan was saying stuff about a leg kick, he failed to mention the punch that Machida landed. Shogun had no flurries, Machida did. Shogun tried a couple take downs and was unsuccessful.[/quote']

 

Dude, I have respected your Skip Bayless approach to your judgement of this fight(seems like your going against the popular opinion just because) but if you use the Machida counter punching the leg kicks you have to take the Fight Metric into account for what it is.

 

That my friend is that Machida was 8 of 42 on headshots, NOT EFFECTIVE AT ALL. If you mean he counter punched Rua's leg kicks by throwing a punch into a block then fine, but dont try to make it something it isnt.

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LOL' date=' if you think I am doing that, I must say that it is not the case.

I have seen my share of decisions that I totally disagree with. Leben vs Starnes. Hughes Serra. Hamill Bisping.

This fight was no where near those in my opinion.[/quote']

 

Your right......It was worse, at least IMO

 

At least in the Bisping fight, they gave the wrong guy a SD....this one they gave a UD to the wrong guy

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If you mean he counter punched Rua's leg kicks by throwing a punch into a block then fine' date=' but dont try to make it something it isnt.[/quote']

 

I saw a heck of a lot more of this than some too, plus many unsuccessful flurries. Machida's hand accuracy was not on point especially after the second and even moreso because Shogun started to get his counter timing/avoidance reaction spot on.

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I formed my own opinion on the fight. If anyone tries to tell me that Shogun dominated the first three rounds then I will take what they say with a grain of salt.

You can talk fight metric all you want. Whether or not the strikes were effective is obviously subjective. You can say it isn't, but the fact that I, and some others, disagree means it is.

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Your right......It was worse' date=' at least IMO

 

At least in the Bisping fight, they gave the wrong guy a SD....this one they gave a UD to the wrong guy[/quote']

 

Now your just being silly.

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I formed my own opinion on the fight. If anyone tries to tell me that Shogun dominated the first three rounds then I will take what they say with a grain of salt.

You can talk fight metric all you want. Whether or not the strikes were effective is obviously subjective. You can say it isn't' date=' but the fact that I, and some others, disagree means it is.[/quote']

 

I was in no way tryiing to insult you or your opinion, as I dont think you took it that way. But I had Machida only "clearly" winning the second round. The 1st and 3rd were crapshoots, but I think favored Rua, IMO. With Rua pulling out the last 2 rounds easily. I don't think that Rua dominated the fight either though. He did however control the pace of the fight, the location within the octagon the exchanges took place, and ultimately had Machida reeling because of the damage from the leg kicks.

 

There is only one aspect of this fight that I thought Machida won, and that was takedowns/takedown defense, but I hardly think that warrants a UD in his favor. Regardless, Machida got the UD and retained his title. I hardly think that he needs to dominate Machida in order to take the belt, because if that is true then Rua will be fighting Machida plus the judges in their second bout, and thats anything but fair. You shouldn't have to KO or sub someone to win a title. Titles have been won and lost before from far less then we saw last Saturday, IMO.

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I was in no way tryiing to insult you or your opinion' date=' as I dont think you took it that way. But I had Machida only "clearly" winning the second round. The 1st and 3rd were crapshoots, but I think favored Rua, IMO. With Rua pulling out the last 2 rounds easily. I don't think that Rua dominated the fight either though. He did however control the pace of the fight, the location within the octagon the exchanges took place, and ultimately had Machida reeling because of the damage from the leg kicks.

 

There is only one aspect of this fight that I thought Machida won, and that was takedowns/takedown defense, but I hardly think that warrants a UD in his favor. Regardless, Machida got the UD and retained his title. I hardly think that he needs to dominate Machida in order to take the belt, because if that is true then Rua will be fighting Machida plus the judges in their second bout, and thats anything but fair. You shouldn't have to KO or sub someone to win a title. Titles have been won and lost before from far less then we saw last Saturday, IMO.[/quote']

I do not expect the rematch to go the distance. I think both guys will have something to prove which will cause more action then the first fight.

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Now your just being silly.

 

Stats don't lie brother.....all there is too it

 

It was a good close fight.....I actually had it a 48/47 Decision for Rua. I've watched the fight 3 times and scored it that way all three times.

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Stats don't lie brother.....all there is too it

 

It was a good close fight.....I actually had it a 48/47 Decision for Rua. I've watched the fight 3 times and scored it that way all three times.

 

But to say that it was worse then the Bisping Hamill or Leben Starnes decision is just crazy my friend. Split or not. Fact is, it was a close fight. Neither of those were.

I respect your opinion, you know this. I just disagree. The first three rounds were Machidas.

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And' date=' I will add that this is not boxing. You can't judge on stats alone.[/quote']

 

fine let's judge on with aggression and octagon control. Shogun kept to the center of the octagon for the majority of the fight, he was easily more aggressive then Machida.

 

So based on stats Shogun takes the effective striking and grappling. Aggression and Octagon Control goes to shogun as well. Match-Shogun

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fine let's judge on with aggression and octagon control. Shogun kept to the center of the octagon for the majority of the fight' date=' he was easily more aggressive then Machida.

 

So based on stats Shogun takes the effective striking and grappling. Aggression and Octagon Control goes to shogun as well. Match-Shogun[/quote']

 

Machida is a counter striker. When Shogun came in, Machida countered and ended the attack. Machida kept the fight right where he wanted it. Standing. Shogun tried to control where the fight went with his failed take down attempts. That is octagon control my friend.

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Machida is a counter striker. When Shogun came in' date=' Machida countered and ended the attack. Machida kept the fight right where he wanted it. Standing. Shogun tried to control where the fight went with his failed take down attempts. That is octagon control my friend.[/quote']

 

Oh G you need to just nuthug on BJ because you don't know what your talking about.

 

It's been said a thousand times by officals, you don't win off being defensives. So even if Shogun failed at his takedowns, that's still more important then Machida defending them. And at the end Machida wasn't countering, he was just running. And Machida's counters weren't effective to where Shogun's attacks were effective. Shogun landed the majority of his shots solid where Machida constantly grazed the arms or shoulders of Shogun.

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But to say that it was worse then the Bisping Hamill or Leben Starnes decision is just crazy my friend. Split or not. Fact is' date=' it was a close fight. Neither of those were.

I respect your opinion, you know this. I just disagree. The first three rounds were Machidas.[/quote'] I highly disagree with that. I give Machida rounds 1 and 3....that all. The rest were Shoguns. I guess people just have different views. I saw Shogun get the better of most exchanges, even in the rare cases when Machida was the one pushing. Even the time that Machida nailed Shogun and got him against the cage..Shogun covered up and took only one or 2 glancing shots...not only that, he ended up landing the more soild shots with his counters. You can pull that Cecil Peoples "Machida landed the harder shots" card if you want....I aint buying. If that was true, how is it that Machida is still limping around and is on medical suspension, and Shogun is unhurt and was cleared with no suspensions.

 

And' date=' I will add that this is not boxing. You can't judge on stats alone.[/quote'] I'm not just going on stats man...its me :). I saw Shogun do most of the stalking, land the most shots in the stand-up and the clinch, go for takedowns showing even more aggression and counter more effectivly. Everytime Machida landed a jab or a stright, he eat a jab and a HARD leg kick for his trouble.

 

But it's over. We could go back and forth all day and its not going to change the fact that Machida is still champion......for now anyway. Really no point in going on. I still respect your views and I know your a knowledgeable dude, we just disagree on this fight.

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I highly disagree with that. I give Machida rounds 1 and 3....that all. The rest were Shoguns. I guess people just have different views. I saw Shogun get the better of most exchanges' date=' even in the rare cases when Machida was the one pushing. Even the time that Machida nailed Shogun and got him against the cage..Shogun covered up and took only one or 2 glancing shots...not only that, he ended up landing the more soild shots with his counters. You can pull that Cecil Peoples "Machida landed the harder shots" card if you want....I aint buying. If that was true, how is it that Machida is still limping around and is on medical suspension, and Shogun is unhurt and was cleared with no suspensions.

 

I'm not just going on stats man...its me :). I saw Shogun do most of the stalking, land the most shots in the stand-up and the clinch, go for takedowns showing even more aggression and counter more effectivly. Everytime Machida landed a jab or a stright, he eat a jab and a HARD leg kick for his trouble.

 

But it's over. We could go back and forth all day and its not going to change the fact that Machida is still champion......for now anyway. Really no point in going on. I still respect your views and I know your a knowledgeable dude, we just disagree on this fight.[/quote']

 

He ain't the champ in my eyes and I will not refer to him as the champ either

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LOL

@

grazed.

Yeah

right.

Stuffing

take

downs

count

less

then

failed

take

down

attempts

now

?

H

A

H

A

H

A

Now

you

sound

like

a

troll.

 

And you sound like a retarded ****. Go ask an actual judge or ref, they will give more favour to the guy attempting anything to a guy that just stands there. But off your logic Kalib Starnes must have really been close to winning against Nate Quarry but defending EVERYTHING but just running. Go watch Diego Sanchez vs John Alessio, John stuffed the majority of Diego's takedowns and did more damage to Diego with his jab. But Diego took the division by pressing the action.

 

 

 

Poor G, you really should learn something

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LOL

@

grazed.

Yeah

right.

Stuffing

take

downs

count

less

then

failed

take

down

attempts

now

?

H

A

H

A

H

A

Now

you

sound

like

a

troll.

 

I think it actually is scored higher than TDD. It shows aggression which is judged. I do think TDD should be scored but I have heard MANY times that its not scored at all or if it is, it gets very little.

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And you sound like a retarded ****. Go ask an actual judge or ref' date=' they will give more favour to the guy attempting anything to a guy that just stands there. But off your logic Kalib Starnes must have really been close to winning against Nate Quarry but defending EVERYTHING but just running. Go watch Diego Sanchez vs John Alessio, John stuffed the majority of Diego's takedowns and did more damage to Diego with his jab. But Diego took the division by pressing the action.

 

 

 

Poor G, you really should learn something[/quote']

 

LOL, you are wrong buddy. The three refs said so.

And, this thread is for mods. Get out.

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I think it actually is scored higher than TDD. It shows aggression which is judged. I do think TDD should be scored but I have heard MANY times that its not scored at all or if it is' date=' it gets very little.[/quote']

 

Failed take down attempts are not scored higher then stuffing take downs. Stuffing take downs goes in to octagon control.

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He ain't the champ in my eyes and I will not refer to him as the champ either

 

Not in mine either, but it doesn't matter what we think....he still is the champion..well, at least on paper anyway :)

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LOL' date=' you are wrong buddy. The three refs said so.

And, this thread is for mods. Get out.[/quote']

 

three boxing judges. And like you said this isn't boxing.

 

 

 

And try to keep me out of this thread

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Failed take down attempts are not scored higher then stuffing take downs. Stuffing take downs goes in to octagon control.

 

And TD attempt go toward Aggression which is scored very highly! More than Octogan control by most because your actually pressing. At best they cancel each other out, I still say TD attempts get you more points though

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