AWB622 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Having this debate with my friend, I don't think BJ quitting on the stool counts as a finish but he does...you guys decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_Against_The_World Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Having this debate with my friend' date=' I don't think BJ quitting on the stool counts as a finish but he does...you guys decide.[/quote'] Half a finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_am_p4p_1 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 not even a finish . A KO or a submission or a ACTUAL TKO where the ref has to pull you off from making a guy unconscious. Ex) Matt Serra vs gsp 1 , THATS a finish not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_am_p4p_1 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 and i dont think making a guy whos to tired to continue but you cant put a bruise on his face or even come close with a submission would ever count as a finish , because theres NO BONUS after, like sotn and kotn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chanman20 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 and i dont think making a guy whos to tired to continue but you cant put a bruise on his face or even come close with a submission would ever count as a finish ' date=' because theres NO BONUS after, like sotn and kotn[/quote'] dont tell GSP fans that omg they will go crazy and cry about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma_Machine Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 yes. when a fighter quits on a stool it means that the winner didn't finish them physically, but mentally, which is one of the hardest things to do at this level. I'm one of the biggest BJ Penn fans but that's still what I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWB622 Posted October 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 and i dont think making a guy whos to tired to continue but you cant put a bruise on his face or even come close with a submission would ever count as a finish ' date=' because theres NO BONUS after, like sotn and kotn[/quote'] That's exactly what I'm saying, BJ quitting is no finish, to me, a finish is the ref stopping the fight due to punched, a KO or submission, a corner stoppage is no finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarWest® Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Does it count as a finish? Yes Do I consider it a finish? No He didn't TKO/KO or submit him, simple as that. I also don't consider cut stoppage a finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHenry Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 yes. when a fighter quits on a stool it means that the winner didn't finish them physically' date=' but mentally, which is one of the hardest things to do at this level. I'm one of the biggest BJ Penn fans but that's still what I think.[/quote'] yep GSP mustve mentally destroyed Penn when he greased for 3 rounds and and the ref just let it continue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma_Machine Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 yep GSP mustve mentally destroyed Penn when he greased for 3 rounds and and the ref just let it continue exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWB622 Posted October 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Does it count as a finish? Yes Do I consider it a finish? No He didn't TKO/KO or submit him' date=' simple as that. I also don't consider cut stoppage a finish.[/quote'] Now this is hypothetical and i doubt this has happened yet, but what if the cut is so bad, I'm talking Joe Steveson vs BJ bad, and he says, screw this I'm done, do you consider that a finish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarWest® Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Now this is hypothetical and i doubt this has happened yet' date=' but what if the cut is so bad, I'm talking Joe Steveson vs BJ bad, and he says, screw this I'm done, do you consider that a finish?[/quote'] No I only consider a finish by TKO/KO or sub, everything else is just technical bs Just my opinion though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyT1222 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 yes. when a fighter quits on a stool it means that the winner didn't finish them physically' date=' but mentally, which is one of the hardest things to do at this level. I'm one of the biggest BJ Penn fans but that's still what I think.[/quote'] ^^^THIS!!! The enigma is clearly the smartest person on this thread. It absolutely is a finish. These people are just GSP haters. If you (op) would have eliminated the names from your poll they would have answered differently. If a man concedes you beat him up so bad that he can't continue to fight, you finished him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juice64011 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 I agree with Enigma. BJ broke mentally and didn't want to continue so it's a finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GN_FDU Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 No it's not a finish because BJ went the entire five rounds without quitting. Oh wait. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aethlefirth Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 wow this is just sad now! i mean the struggle people go to to try and troll and also to have a go at the great 1,it was a finish because the fight did not continue brain trust! the tubby little fella quit on his stool so the fight was stopped by the ref that is called a TKO and that is a finish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peanutz Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 well BJ could not finish the full duration of the fight, so the fight was stopped. by definition, yes it is a finish via TKO(Doctor's Stoppage) that WAS THE OFFICIAL DECISION. however GSP is still a greaser and safe fighter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfwGSP Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 So do submissions count as a finish? If you're opponent quitting doesn't count as a finish, then submissions don't count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yerbo Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 That's exactly what I'm saying' date=' BJ quitting is no finish, to me, a finish is the ref stopping the fight due to punched, a KO or submission, a corner stoppage is no finish.[/quote'] The corner stoppage you refer to is the same as a tap out. It's a finish. That said, the whole "BJ never quit it was his corner" thing is BS. In between rounds I'm sure BJ was asked if he wanted to continue. He didn't say yes so that's the same as quitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PuffDaddy92 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 wow this is just sad now! i mean the struggle people go to to try and troll and also to have a go at the great 1' date='it was a finish because the fight did not continue brain trust! the tubby little fella quit on his stool so the fight was stopped by the ref that is called a TKO and that is a finish [/quote'] u wouldnt last 30 seconds with that "tubby little fella" u fool.. if seen him in real life u would probably start kissing his **** aswell lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jduk Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 BJ conceded defeat. The fight did not reach a decision, so yeah I consider it a finish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijosef Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Yes, it was a finish. BJ conceded defeat after the fact, but it was his corner that stopped the fight between the fourth and fifth rounds. BJ claimed he didn't even remember anything past the third round in that fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epilogue1406051983 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 BJ quit, so yes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boone1406050353 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Having this debate with my friend' date=' I don't think BJ quitting on the stool counts as a finish but he does...you guys decide.[/quote'] Technically i'd say no. But it's much worse to quit then to get finished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chanman20 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 wow this is just sad now! i mean the struggle people go to to try and troll and also to have a go at the great 1' date='it was a finish because the fight did not continue brain trust! the tubby little fella quit on his stool so the fight was stopped by the ref that is called a TKO and that is a finish [/quote'] soo should GSP lost cause he greased and that means he cheated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheradon Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Having this debate with my friend' date=' I don't think BJ quitting on the stool counts as a finish but he does...you guys decide.[/quote'] Yes, it's a finish. It's no different then him tapping to strikes or exhaustion in the middle of a round. If you beat your opponent so bad that he quits, whether in the round or inbetween it, you finished them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techn0Viking Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Even if it was a finish, GSP shouldn't get credit because he greased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrdogg Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 The simple answer is that if BJ would have went out for the 5th round, the fight would have probably been stopped at some point by the ref because he had nothing left to defend with. That, or BJ would have got seriously injured. Who cares if it was a finish in the traditional sense, GSP won decisively and beat down the guy who talked all the ****. It's a satisfying win and he has moved on. Only the haters keep bringing up the grease excuse for BJ's loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossles Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 The simple answer is that if BJ would have went out for the 5th round' date=' the fight would have probably been stopped at some point by the ref because he had nothing left to defend with. That, or BJ would have got seriously injured. Who cares if it was a finish in the traditional sense, GSP won decisively and beat down the guy who talked all the ****. It's a satisfying win and he has moved on. Only the haters keep bringing up the grease excuse for BJ's loss.[/quote'] Not really an excuse when there is proof of it... Not gonna say it changed the outcome of the fight, but if this happened to a non poster boy fighter. Serious actions would have taken place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LW4MMA Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Having this debate with my friend' date=' I don't think BJ quitting on the stool counts as a finish but he does...you guys decide.[/quote']Did the fight go the scheduled 5 rounds? No. Thus the fight was "finished" before ending and going to a decision. The answer is a very obvious YES it was a finish. not even a finish . A KO or a submission or a ACTUAL TKO where the ref has to pull you off from making a guy unconscious. Ex) Matt Serra vs gsp 1 ' date=' THATS a finish not[/quote'] Fighters can quit during a fight too, it's still a finish regardless if they quit on the stool or tap while leaning on the cage. There's no "Bleeding bonus" either but a fight can be stopped and finished from a cut! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wirerat Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 If someone quits before the end of the fight, he's FINISHED. It's that friggen simple. It's the exact same thing as a tap out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyT1222 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 I would just like the forum to know, the op, AWB and I are close friends in real life and I am the guy who was having the debate with him. According to the poll, I'm currently winning because it OBVIOUSLY is a finish! So thanks everybody for helping!!! Hey AWB... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurion480 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 If someone quits before the end of the fight' date=' he's FINISHED. It's that friggen simple. It's the exact same thing as a tap out.[/quote'] ^Yes. Without GSP, Bj could have sat in the octagon for 25 minutes With GSP, he couldn't last. Therefore, GSP caused BJ to quit thus finishing the fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therien87 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 ^Yes. Without GSP' date=' Bj could have sat in the octagon for 25 minutes With GSP, he couldn't last. Therefore, GSP caused BJ to quit thus finishing the fight.[/quote'] there you have it. I don't even understand the debate. Same thing than tapping.. the guy couln't fight no more because of what his opponent did to him.. therefore GSP finished bj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingzero8717 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Does it count as a finish? Yes Do I consider it a finish? No He didn't TKO/KO or submit him' date=' simple as that. I also don't consider cut stoppage a finish.[/quote'] If GSP hadn't cheated and used a greasing agent i would have considered it a finish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mg10 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 If the fight did not go 5 rounds then it is a finish. If you want to start talking about whether GSP broke rules thats another topic, but it is listed as a TKO and thats what it is. May not have been a referee stoppage in the middle of the round, but if the doctor says the fighter is done before the next round starts then it is a stoppage. I am not one who believes BJ quit himself, his brother told the doctor to end it if I remember correctly. However if they doctor and referee decide the fights over, then it is over and it is a finish for the winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King_Can Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 finished him mentally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent555 Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 It was obviously a finish and the only reason the poll is so close is because it was GSP, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentson Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Gsp couldn't finish a ham sandwhich. Penn finished himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryodog Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Gsp couldn't finish a ham sandwhich. Penn finished himself. Ahh lol, good ol' Penn fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBEVIL Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Gsp couldn't finish a ham sandwhich. Penn finished himself. i certainly wouldnt want to finish a ham sandwich so i understand if GSP cant either. Now turkey.. thats another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapst Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 How can the answer be no? How is literally making your opponent QUIT not MORE of an achievement than KO'ing or submitting an opponent, which can imply a # of different things? Not many people have the ability to take someones heart away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waikru Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 I like how people interpret things when they don't like a fighter. BJ Penns loss was due to his brother calling for a stop to the bout. Also keep in mind that there was numerous punches to the back of the head prior to the end of that round and its subsequent stoppage. There has been a lot of specualtion as to whether BJ Penn quit, the doctor stopped the fight, the towel was thrown in, or the ref stopped the fight but according to Yahoo?s Kevin Iole, BJ Penn?s brother Jay Dee Penn asked the doctor and Herb Dean to stop the fight at UFC 94. After the fourth round Herb Dean and the doctor where talking about whether to stop the fight when Jay Dee Penn stepped in asked them to stop the fight. This would give Georges St. Pierre the TKO victory. Or until all hell broke loose the next day when vaseline-gate started. All of this is now being sorted out by the Nevada State Athletic Commission. http://www.aroundtheoctagon.com/?p=757 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEmperor Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 tapping to strikes is a finish, filled with lols. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mile_High_Junkie Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Penn submitted between rounds... that more ***** than tapping to strikes. Who quits during their break? If the doctor stopped it for whatever reason between rounds it would be a tko, so BJ quitting in my book constitutes as a verbal stoppage. They should have made BJ tap on the mat to symbolize his tears of defeat. FINISH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waikru Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Penn submitted between rounds... that more ***** than tapping to strikes. Who quits during their break? If the doctor stopped it for whatever reason between rounds it would be a tko' date=' so BJ quitting in my book constitutes as a verbal stoppage. They should have made BJ tap on the mat to symbolize his tears of defeat. FINISH.[/quote'] His brother stopped the fight. How is that the same as BJ giving up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryodog Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 I like how people interpret things when they don't like a fighter. BJ Penns loss was due to his brother calling for a stop to the bout. Also keep in mind that there was numerous punches to the back of the head prior to the end of that round and its subsequent stoppage. There has been a lot of specualtion as to whether BJ Penn quit' date=' the doctor stopped the fight, the towel was thrown in, or the ref stopped the fight but according to Yahoo?s Kevin Iole, BJ Penn?s brother Jay Dee Penn asked the doctor and Herb Dean to stop the fight at UFC 94. After the fourth round Herb Dean and the doctor where talking about whether to stop the fight when Jay Dee Penn stepped in asked them to stop the fight. This would give Georges St. Pierre the TKO victory. Or until all hell broke loose the next day when vaseline-gate started. All of this is now being sorted out by the Nevada State Athletic Commission.[/b'] http://www.aroundtheoctagon.com/?p=757 Did he finish the fight dawg? ... U mad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBEVIL Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 I like how people interpret things when they don't like a fighter. BJ Penns loss was due to his brother calling for a stop to the bout. Also keep in mind that there was numerous punches to the back of the head prior to the end of that round and its subsequent stoppage. There has been a lot of specualtion as to whether BJ Penn quit' date=' the doctor stopped the fight, the towel was thrown in, or the ref stopped the fight but according to Yahoo?s Kevin Iole, BJ Penn?s brother Jay Dee Penn asked the doctor and Herb Dean to stop the fight at UFC 94. After the fourth round Herb Dean and the doctor where talking about whether to stop the fight when Jay Dee Penn stepped in asked them to stop the fight. This would give Georges St. Pierre the TKO victory. Or until all hell broke loose the next day when vaseline-gate started. All of this is now being sorted out by the Nevada State Athletic Commission.[/b'] http://www.aroundtheoctagon.com/?p=757 its not like BJ tried to stop his brother.. its not like BJ got mad at his brother.. its not like BJ blamed it on his brother.. BJ was done, he had enough, simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waikru Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 Did he finish the fight dawg?... U mad? No. Are you mad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waikru Posted October 6, 2011 Report Share Posted October 6, 2011 its not like BJ tried to stop his brother.. its not like BJ got mad at his brother.. its not like BJ blamed it on his brother.. BJ was done' date=' he had enough, simple as that.[/quote'] You can try to rationalize it how you like. The fact is his brother stopped the fight. That is quite different than quitting. If you feel that it is exactly the same, then why mischaracterize it by saying he quit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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