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Even the most diehard of Shoguns fans have to admit..


||LastManStanding||

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Not hating, not trolling...but he looks like he's done. Like all those other chute box wrecking machines of old, he's just done. Maybe it's his body giving out, or his flame fading but Mauricio Shogun Rua is no more.

 

Picking the Vera fight to begin with, going for takedowns even early in the 1st, getting caught easily with lazy punches, gassing, the flubby gut they're al just signs on the wall.

 

Maybe it's time he focused on coaching and sharing his knowledge with the next generation.

 

How do you guys feel about this?

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It's kind of depressing because if he had retired after beating Lyoto Machida he may have gone down as being remembered as one of the GOATs. It's crazy how when fighters continue to fight past their prime, they tarnish their careers. I can think of a few former champions who if they had retired in their prime, would be remembered as GOAT, instead of a can.

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Shogun looked like he did not even train for that fight. No professional fighter should be gassed after the first round. He reminded me of BJ Penn the way his cardio looked. Todays fighters are too good for someone to just show up and hope to win. An in shape and dedicated Shogun would destroy Vera without breaking a sweat.

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Shogun looked like he did not even train for that fight. No professional fighter should be gassed after the first round. He reminded me of BJ Penn the way his cardio looked. Todays fighters are too good for someone to just show up and hope to win. An in shape and dedicated Shogun would destroy Vera without breaking a sweat.

 

:(

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Shogun looked like he did not even train for that fight. No professional fighter should be gassed after the first round. He reminded me of BJ Penn the way his cardio looked. Todays fighters are too good for someone to just show up and hope to win. An in shape and dedicated Shogun would destroy Vera without breaking a sweat.

 

Lol oh boy, here we go.

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shogun looked like he did not even train for that fight. No professional fighter should be gassed after the first round. He reminded me of bj penn the way his cardio looked. Todays fighters are too good for someone to just show up and hope to win. an in shape and dedicated shogun would destroy vera without breaking a sweat.

 

lmao

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Tbo, his performance in this fight wasn't worse than in the hendo fight. Here took loads of shots there as well, both were wars, only difference is that people had higher expectations now cause he faced a supposedly weaker opponent.

 

Shogun is on his way to wandy status, always brings it, but doesn't look as sharp as he used to.

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Last I checked he still destroyed Vera. Plus his only real loss in his last 5 fights was against Jones who does that to everybody. Fight with Hendo could easily have been a draw and Hendo is the numbe one contender right now.

And something else Joe Rogan is an idiot for talking that Shogun is only a striker and doesnt take guys down.

He took down or at least tried to takedown almost every opponent he ever faced!

He took down Rampage, Nogueira,Arona,Liddel, Owereem, Coleman, Griffin, Hendo...

Shogun is still very much relevant. He just needs to work a little more on his cardio.

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Yeah the only 2 fights Shogun looked impressive in the UFC imo, was against Machida the first fight not the second one and Forrest rematch.

 

Even the second Machida fight he was being picked apart, he caught Machida and won it ofc but had it gone further he looked like he woulda lost, and agasint Henderson ppl say that was a great performance by him, it wasnt he got hit way too many times he shud have and he shud have finished Henderson in that fight had he been in his prime.

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Last I checked he still destroyed Vera. Plus his only real loss in his last 5 fights was against Jones who does that to everybody. Fight with Hendo could easily have been a draw and Hendo is the numbe one contender right now.

And something else Joe Rogan is an idiot for talking that Shogun is only a striker and doesnt take guys down.

He took down or at least tried to takedown almost every opponent he ever faced!

He took down Rampage' date=' Nogueira,Arona,Liddel, Owereem, Coleman, Griffin, Hendo...

Shogun is still very much relevant. He just needs to work a little more on his cardio.[/quote']

 

THANKYOU.

 

Ive been getting irritated with people talking about how Shoguns all kickboxing and him taking Vera down was a victory for Brandon.

No, Shogun has no problem taking guys down, his pride is OK with using all facets of MMA.

 

I actually expected him to take Vera down as im sure many Shogun fans did. Lets go back to Cyril Diabate in Pride. He and Vera are quite similar fighters, quite rangy, fast strikers.

Shogun was having abit of trouble with him so he dragged him to the mat and finished him.

Vera put up more of a fight than the snake however.

 

Shoguns not the same fighter, no. I dont think its about commitment but more to do with the effect training has on his knees.

 

I think he should fight Rampage next, then depending on the result of that fight Hendo should be next up. After that id be looking for him to retire. (Maybe once he retires people will show him the respect he has EARNED).

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Yeah the only 2 fights Shogun looked impressive in the UFC imo' date=' was against Machida the first fight not the second one and Forrest rematch.

 

Even the second Machida fight he was being picked apart, he caught Machida and won it ofc but had it gone further he looked like he woulda lost, and agasint Henderson ppl say that was a great performance by him, it wasnt he got hit way too many times he shud have and he shud have finished Henderson in that fight had he been in his prime.[/quote']

 

How was KTFOing Machida, Liddel and Griffin not impresive? If you would lok at Shoguns early fights you would see that he always gets hit a lot. Its is style. Eat one to return one stronger.When his chin wount work out anymore, then he will have a problem.

Plus Hendo is a monster who looks like he is at the peak of is carrer. What was impressive in that fight was Shoguns pure hearth. Not a lot of fighters would have taken that beating and actually come back strong

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How was KTFOing Machida' date=' Liddel and Griffin not impresive? If you would lok at Shoguns early fights you would see that he always gets hit a lot. Its is style. Eat one to return one stronger.When his chin wount work out anymore, then he will have a problem.

Plus Hendo is a monster who looks like he is at the peak of is carrer. What was impressive in that fight was Shoguns pure hearth. Not a lot of fighters would have taken that beating and actually come back strong[/quote']

 

First off go read my message again I said Koing Griffin was one of the 2 great performances he had in UFC, but Machida rematch and Hendo fight he was getting beat up pretty bad before he did anything. A lucky punch caught Machida, and agasint Hendo he looked terrible he shud have Koed that MW chump.

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If shogun had fought anyone else, with anymore cardio in this last fight, he would have lost. Vera gave Shogun that win, cause he was too tired to finish him, which any other fighter would have. They both looked out of shape. I expected a bit of that from Vera, being gone as long as he has, but Shogun?

 

Look, maybe he is still relevant and just took Vera Lightly. I don't know. But, he looked like dog starfish in that fight. People that are calling that his strategy. LOL

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First off go read my message again I said Koing Griffin was one of the 2 great performances he had in UFC' date=' but Machida rematch and Hendo fight he was getting beat up pretty bad before he did anything. A lucky punch caught Machida, and agasint Hendo he looked terrible he shud have Koed that MW chump.[/quote']

 

Yeah,but he's definitely slowing down,he was faster in the Machida fights..

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I still think Shogun is very much important to LHW still. But unlike his reputation coming into the UFC, I dont think people expect much from him. On a good night, he can beat anyone, on a bad, anyone can beat him. And considering his injuries, this is a bad mix for a guy who wants to sustain his top game for more than a 2 fight streak.

 

Overall his striking is over rated. He has too much confidence and gets caught. He was so dominant before from his athleticism, and now with injuries, that aspect to his game is slipping.

 

Id like to see Rashad vs Shogun, I think thats a great matchup for him, and Id like to see him bounce back. But even if he does, how long would the reinvigorated Shogun last? He may be the new Penn, and not by the fact hes lazy, but actually works too hard and hurts himself.

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I still think Shogun is very much important to LHW still. But unlike his reputation coming into the UFC' date=' I dont think people expect much from him. On a good night, he can beat anyone, on a bad, anyone can beat him. And considering his injuries, this is a bad mix for a guy who wants to sustain his top game for more than a 2 fight streak.

 

[b']Overall his striking is over rated. He has too much confidence and gets caught. He was so dominant before from his athleticism, and now with injuries, that aspect to his game is slipping.[/b]

 

Id like to see Rashad vs Shogun, I think thats a great matchup for him, and Id like to see him bounce back. But even if he does, how long would the reinvigorated Shogun last? He may be the new Penn, and not by the fact hes lazy, but actually works too hard and hurts himself.

 

I personally think his striking has been incomplete. Post knee surgeries his legs have pretty much been unused in his fights. He hasn't kicked anyone or used his legs at all since all the surgeries. Now he's depending only on his hands and is STILL getting KO's (against OK not great comp [except Machida])

 

whatever the reason is that he performs like he has whether its physical or mental if it can't be overcome I'd rather see Shogun call it quits than keep going. Don't want to see him end up like Maurilo.

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whatever the reason is that he performs like he has whether its physical or mental if it can't be overcome I'd rather see Shogun call it quits than keep going. Don't want to see him end up like Maurilo.

 

This exactely. Also to people saying he's still young. He's young, yes, but age is not the only factor. It's the mileage. Guys like Wandy and Shogun are mentally tough because of the physical abuse they've put themselves through in fighting but certainly in training as well. Those chute box training methods were grueling.

 

I think this is just where Shoguns body is starting to tell him enough is enough. I'd like to see him take on a protoge or something. Tarnishing your name by suffering inevitable beatdowns would be a sad end for Shogun.

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First off go read my message again I said Koing Griffin was one of the 2 great performances he had in UFC' date=' but Machida rematch and Hendo fight he was getting beat up pretty bad before he did anything. A lucky punch caught Machida, and agasint Hendo he looked terrible he shud have Koed that MW chump.[/quote']

 

There was nothing lucky about that punch that caught Machida. And u act like Macida dominated those minutes before that. Get real. He was getting tagged more than he ever did before. Outside of those two takedowns Machida had zero success in that fight. At best we can call it, that it was even before he got KOed.

Calling Hendo a chump is redicoulus. Hendo is one of the best fighters of all time without a doubt and besides noone has stopped Hendo with strikes before.

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im so glad shogun didnt get the shot, he gassed hard in a contender fight in the second round after a decent round but not a guida like level of exertion in it.

 

both fighters looked very wooden they just stood infront of each other throwing the odd shot, i mean vera kneeling by the cage and shogun esentially letting him stand without even aiming for his unprotected head. It looked like two has beens fighting lets be honest. Im not saying shogun is a has been but his cardio was terrible in that fight and had he been up agaisnt jones he would of been in serious trouble that first round and vera msot likely KOd.

 

machida looked seriously motivated and in the best shape i have seen him in. Hehhad a picture perfect fight against bader and i doubt he would of had any trouble beating vera neither. Machida still has the heart he wants the title. I fear shogun just wants the pay check from another ppv.

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I wonder how much his injuries prevent him from having the kind of training camp an elite fighter needs to keep his cardio up. He *looked* in better shape coming in. And while i used to use the excuse back in the Jones/Hendo fights that he was rocked early, and that instantly takes a lot out of your sails, I dont know if that is the case with Vera.

 

But then again, he did go 5 rounds with Hendo and actually won the attrition war in that fight. And eventually wore down Vera in the championship rounds again. So whos to say his cardio is that bad....we all might be just looking for excuses. Because on paper, this guy should be top 10 P4P

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there was nothing lucky about that punch that caught machida. And u act like macida dominated those minutes before that. Get real. He was getting tagged more than he ever did before. Outside of those two takedowns machida had zero success in that fight. At best we can call it' date=' that it was even before he got koed.

Calling hendo a chump is redicoulus. Hendo is one of the best fighters of all time without a doubt and besides noone has stopped hendo with strikes before.[/quote']

 

sir i have my golden ticket into the excuse factory

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Lol oh boy' date=' here we go.[/quote']

 

Please explain your anwer. How did Shogun not look out of shape or gassed after the first round. Both he and Vera looked like they were moving in slow motion. If that Shogun shows up against a top contender he will get KTFO or submitted in a hurry.

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shogun knocks out forrest griffin in under one minute, loses a close decision to the top contender in one the greatest mma fights in recent history (which imo shouldv been a draw), he knocks out brandon vera in another highly entertaining fight.

 

and he's supposed to be done?

 

he'll never be champ again but unless his career path goes towards that of chuck liddell, I really don't see why he should retire. the only guy that destroyed him was bones and he does that to everybody.

 

bad or good cardio, he still gives us awesome fights and in the end isn't that what it's about?

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shogun knocks out forrest griffin in under one minute' date=' loses a close decision to the top contender in one the greatest mma fights in recent history (which imo shouldv been a draw), he knocks out brandon vera in another highly entertaining fight.

 

and he's supposed to be done?

 

he'll never be champ again but unless his career path goes towards that of chuck liddell, I really don't see why he should retire. the only guy that destroyed him was bones and he does that to everybody.

 

bad or good cardio, he still gives us awesome fights and in the end isn't that what it's about?[/quote']

 

Yeah I don't get it either. Vera has never been stopped on his feet... the TKO loss to Werdum was one of the worst reffing calls of all time. Tko loss to Jones was grounded from elbows.

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regardless if you think hes done or not. He smashed Machida not once but twice.

 

If there was a ranking system i could never put Machida above Rua until he actually beats him. Also that Henderson vs Rua fight was damn close.

 

I agree it was interesting he didnt want to kickbox wth Vera at all. He wanted no part of the kickboxing. He decided to go the Holding against the cage route, but that was his call and he still defeated Vera convincingly enough, even if Vera put up a good fight, which he did. But he still didnt match Rua's skills and turtled many times.

 

All in all, Rua smashed Vera if you really think about it. Many parts of the fight he was getting dominated in the wrestling(which he shouldnt be, considering Vera's grecco roman wrestler backround) and in the end was pounding on Vera badly.

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I personally think his striking has been incomplete. Post knee surgeries his legs have pretty much been unused in his fights. He hasn't kicked anyone or used his legs at all since all the surgeries. Now he's depending only on his hands and is STILL getting KO's (against OK not great comp [except Machida])

 

whatever the reason is that he performs like he has whether its physical or mental if it can't be overcome I'd rather see Shogun call it quits than keep going. Don't want to see him end up like Maurilo.

 

Finally somebody mentions the KICKS! There's obviously something wrong. His cardio was non acceptable for a supposely top contenter.

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I would have to agree, that Shogun is not the same fighter he was back in Pride, but he still puts on a heck of a fight. Out of the Legends, I don't think anyone has shown as much heart in the cage a Rua does. He can still bang with the best at 205, so I hope he sticks around for a few more fights.. He's a "hall of famer" no matter what he chooses to do.

 

I think Vera looked alot better as well, he came to fight, showed a few glimpses of what he is capable of doing when he gets down to it.

 

That was the best fight card in recent memory!

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Shogun looks like he literally doesn't train before his fights now. He's never been a guy with any type of definition but in the UFC' date=' he's been chubby around the waist in almost everyone of his fights. Smh. He's still my boy though.[/quote']

 

some people are just chubby bro

 

look at Cormier, he trains his *** off and still has a bit of a belly

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Agree I was thoroughly dissapointed in shoguns performance' date=' you cant come into a #1 contender fight out of shape and uncondintioned. Its just not right, I miss Pride ' soccer kick your face off ' shogun.[/quote']

 

hes not #1 contender in my books Gustafsson is. However if there was a ranking system you couldnt really put Rua above Machida, since hes beaten Machida twice. Rua is still top 5 at the moment with kicks or without.

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hes not #1 contender in my books Gustafsson is. However if there was a ranking system you couldnt really put Rua above Machida' date=' since hes beaten Machida twice. Rua is still top 5 at the moment with kicks or without.[/quote']

 

Gus needs to fight another higher ranked fighter to justify making him a #1 contender, he has looked impressive but let him fight Rashad, Henderson, Bader, Shogun or even Davis (again) first

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Gus needs to fight another higher ranked fighter to justify making him a #1 contender' date=' he has looked impressive but let him fight Rashad, Henderson, Bader, Shogun or even Davis (again) first[/quote']

 

i just find it really difficult to call a fighter sht if hes beaten Machida TWICE lol. It doesnt make any sense to me.

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i just find it really difficult to call a fighter sht if hes beaten Machida TWICE lol. It doesnt make any sense to me.

 

I don't think he's a ****** fighter but I do think he just happens to have Machida's number. I think Machida has a better chance to get and keep the belt then just about anyone else in the division. Based off both of their fights last night as it's pretty clear to me that Machida deserves the shot more as Shogun would gas way too quickly against Jones for the fight to be even remotely competative. I don't know that Machida can take the belt back, but he is the number 3 LHW in the world imo. (I rank Rashad above him, despite the fact Machida knocked him out. I think Rashad was just too ****y in that fight)

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