Will the media have enough mettle to call out Paul Ryan on his campaign of blatant li

[fobar]

No doubt about it, Paul Ryan's acceptance speech at the Republican National Convention the other night was a daring display, especially for a guy with his last name. If Ryan keeps spouting so many blatant and easily checkable lies, the temptation to comedy show and newspaper headline writers will be too much for frail mortals to bear: The Republican vice presidential nominee may soon find himself branded "Lyin' Ryan".

 

link: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/09/201291925132175.html?utm_content=automate&utm_campaign=Trial6&utm_source=NewSocialFlow&utm_term=plustweets&utm_medium=MasterAccount

 

discuss thanks

[dfwGSP]

He's actually going to be on our campus tomorrow night for a speech. I'm hoping to get off work so I can go. I don't care much for politics, but it still seems kind of cool to go to.

[Kevbo_Jones]

It's already begun. His lie filled speech has been analyzed thoroughly. Even to the point of his supporters are using terms like "this campaign won't be ruined by fact checkers..." Uhh... :confused:

[fobar]

What happened to the good old days of politics, when they would lie and you really had to work to find out if the were telling the truth or not? It's amazing the party are happy to just go along with it.

 

I have long been disgusted at politics, this guy is hammering home the message that truth means nothing, its winning that counts

[fobar]

It's already begun. His lie filled speech has been analyzed thoroughly. Even to the point of his supporters are using terms like "this campaign won't be ruined by fact checkers..." Uhh... :confused:

wow, what can you say to that

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

They already have...

 

I even saw a fox news piece trashing him with disgust.

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

No doubt about it' date=' Paul Ryan's acceptance speech at the Republican National Convention the other night was a daring display, especially for a guy with his last name. If Ryan keeps spouting so many blatant and easily checkable lies, the temptation to comedy show and newspaper headline writers will be too much for frail mortals to bear: The Republican vice presidential nominee may soon find himself branded "Lyin' Ryan".

 

link: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/09/201291925132175.html?utm_content=automate&utm_campaign=Trial6&utm_source=NewSocialFlow&utm_term=plustweets&utm_medium=MasterAccount

 

discuss thanks[/quote']

 

And your not concerned with the endless lies Obama & Biden have been spewing since they took office? Sorry, but I see right through your feigned indignation..

 

 

FYI - I'm not even interested in reading what your source has to say, as its likely the same canned crock of **** everyone else is saying - most of which has already been refuted.

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

What happened to the good old days of politics' date=' when they would lie and you really had to work to find out if the were telling the truth or not? It's amazing the party are happy to just go along with it.

 

I have long been disgusted at politics, this guy is hammering home the message that truth means nothing, its winning that counts[/quote']

 

cmon, these days a lie is really just when one side disagrees and refuses to acknowledge whatever you say....and yeah, both sides do that. Thats why its up to us to be better educated and insightful to whats going on and not rely on what they say but rather what they do.

[KINGnoob]

Good thing we have debates fobar. The reason the lefts ****** hurts over this guy is because he is bursting with character and likability. Ruh roh! Not a likable republican. Slam him!

 

The problem with the news is its slammed with left wing bull **** so finding the truth about the gm plant will be hard for me to do. I know though that CNN said he was telling the truth. The plant was suppose to close in 2008 and it didn't it stayed open for another year or whatever and then closed even after Obama promised them it wouldn't. Aw sad.

 

The rest of the "lies" are prefect bring up questions in his future interviews and debates. So keep your panties tight and snug nd stop flipping the **** out. The left is terrified of ryan and its easy to see why. The dudes a stud.

 

So let's keep this on point, I say Ryan addressess all his lies while Obama addresses all his. Sound fair?

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/083012-624188-so-called-fact-checks-disguise-media-liberal-agenda.htm

 

 

Journalism: If media "fact checkers" are just impartial guardians of the truth, how come they got their own facts wrong about Paul Ryan's speech, and did so in a way that helped President Obama's re-election effort?

 

Case in point was the rush of "fact check" stories claiming Ryan misled when he talked about a shuttered auto plant in his home state.

 

Washington Post fact-checker Glenn Kessler posted a piece ? "Ryan misleads on GM plant closing in hometown" ? saying Ryan "appeared to suggest" that Obama was responsible for the closure of a GM plant in Janesville, Wis.

 

"That's not true," Kessler said. "The plant was closed in December 2008, before Obama was sworn in."

 

What's not true are Kessler's "facts." Ryan didn't suggest Obama was responsible for shuttering the plant. Instead, he correctly noted that Obama promised during the campaign that the troubled plant "will be here for another hundred years" if his policies were enacted.

 

Also, the plant didn't close in December 2008. It was still producing cars until April 2009.

 

An AP "fact check" also claimed that "the plant halted production in December 2008" even though the AP itself reported in April 2009 that the plant was only then "closing for good."

 

CNN's John King made the same claim about that plant closure. But when CNN looked more carefully at the evidence, it ? to its credit ? concluded that what Ryan said was "true."

 

 

 

 

 

Media fact-checkers also complained about Ryan's charge that Obama is cutting $716 billion from Medicare to fund ObamaCare. Not true, they said. Medicare's growth is just being slowed.

 

But Obama achieves that slower growth by making real cuts in provider payments. And in any case, the media always and everywhere call a reduction in the rate of federal spending growth a "cut." So why suddenly charge Ryan with being misleading for using that same term?

 

In any case, Obama himself admitted that he's doing what Ryan says. In a November 2009 interview with ABC News, reporter Jake Tapper said to Obama that "one-third of the funding comes from cuts to Medicare," to which Obama's response was: "Right."

 

The rest of Ryan's alleged factual errors aren't errors at all; it's just that the media didn't like how he said it. But since when is it a fact-checker's job to decide how a politician should construct his arguments?

 

This isn't to say that journalists shouldn't check facts. Of course they should.

 

The problem is that the mainstream press is now abusing the "fact check" label, using it to more aggressively push a liberal agenda without feeling the need to provide any balance whatsoever. And, as the reaction to the Ryan speech shows, they are now blatantly using it to provide air support for Obama.

 

Is it any wonder that soon after Ryan's speech ended, the Obama campaign rushed out an ad using the media's "fact check" stories as its source?

[KINGnoob]

http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/083012-624188-so-called-fact-checks-disguise-media-liberal-agenda.htm

 

 

Journalism: If media "fact checkers" are just impartial guardians of the truth' date=' how come they got their own facts wrong about Paul Ryan's speech, and did so in a way that helped President Obama's re-election effort?

 

Case in point was the rush of "fact check" stories claiming Ryan misled when he talked about a shuttered auto plant in his home state.

 

Washington Post fact-checker Glenn Kessler posted a piece ? "Ryan misleads on GM plant closing in hometown" ? saying Ryan "appeared to suggest" that Obama was responsible for the closure of a GM plant in Janesville, Wis.

 

"That's not true," Kessler said. "The plant was closed in December 2008, before Obama was sworn in."

 

What's not true are Kessler's "facts." Ryan didn't suggest Obama was responsible for shuttering the plant. Instead, he correctly noted that Obama promised during the campaign that the troubled plant "will be here for another hundred years" if his policies were enacted.

 

Also, the plant didn't close in December 2008. It was still producing cars until April 2009.

 

An AP "fact check" also claimed that "the plant halted production in December 2008" even though the AP itself reported in April 2009 that the plant was only then "closing for good."

 

CNN's John King made the same claim about that plant closure. But when CNN looked more carefully at the evidence, it ? to its credit ? concluded that what Ryan said was "true."

 

 

 

 

 

Media fact-checkers also complained about Ryan's charge that Obama is cutting $716 billion from Medicare to fund ObamaCare. Not true, they said. Medicare's growth is just being slowed.

 

But Obama achieves that slower growth by making real cuts in provider payments. And in any case, the media always and everywhere call a reduction in the rate of federal spending growth a "cut." So why suddenly charge Ryan with being misleading for using that same term?

 

In any case, Obama himself admitted that he's doing what Ryan says. In a November 2009 interview with ABC News, reporter Jake Tapper said to Obama that "one-third of the funding comes from cuts to Medicare," to which Obama's response was: "Right."

 

The rest of Ryan's alleged factual errors aren't errors at all; it's just that the media didn't like how he said it. But since when is it a fact-checker's job to decide how a politician should construct his arguments?

 

This isn't to say that journalists shouldn't check facts. Of course they should.

 

The problem is that the mainstream press is now abusing the "fact check" label, using it to more aggressively push a liberal agenda without feeling the need to provide any balance whatsoever. And, as the reaction to the Ryan speech shows, they are now blatantly using it to provide air support for Obama.

 

Is it any wonder that soon after Ryan's speech ended, the Obama campaign rushed out an ad using the media's "fact check" stories as its source?[/quote']

 

Lol boom. Love it!

 

It's in the liberal media so it must be true! Silly fobar. It's fine though, I sAy hold there feet to the fire. Lets see this **** play out. Let's keep it both sides though.

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

Lol boom. Love it!

 

It's in the liberal media so it must be true! Silly fobar. It's fine though' date=' I sAy hold there feet to the fire. Lets see this **** play out. Let's keep it both sides though.[/quote']

 

i dont fault or blame fobar - as I dont perceive him as being a news junkie like you & I. I see him as a concerned & curious fellow who has plenty of contempt for all politicians, but I def see his leftist leanings/bias

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

Lol boom. Love it!

 

It's in the liberal media so it must be true! Silly fobar. It's fine though' date=' I sAy hold there feet to the fire. Lets see this **** play out. Let's keep it both sides though.[/quote']

It wasn't just the liberal media. LIke i said Fox news did some reports on it.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

 

They all suck either way.

 

And the comment on the plant was plain retarded imo. He acted as if Obama's policies had a chance to save the plant and they didn't. Obama said a plant like that would stay open under his policies and you can't save a company like that in 4 months (if they really did close in April.) That specific plant was long gone before Obama had a chance for his policies to effect it (not saying they would either.) It was a blatant attempt to throw Obama under the bus and he got called out on it. Tough ****.

 

 

**** Obama - really hope i don't get sick in the next 4 years if he's elected.

 

**** ROmney - seems War happy and very shady as a business man.

[fobar]

Lol boom. Love it!

 

It's in the liberal media so it must be true! Silly fobar. It's fine though' date=' I sAy hold there feet to the fire. Lets see this **** play out. Let's keep it both sides though.[/quote']

the only part I need to read is this. you have failed to miss the point again. I have clearly stated before that I have grown disgusted at the lies of politics. did I pick a side, no. i just highlight what you havent, the lies from the other side.

 

its ok to continually knock Obama, i dont really care about that. just pointing to everyone telling such blatant lies is making more and more people turned off to politics.

 

would be nice to have some truth about how they are really going to work when in office, instead of the stupid he said/ he said arguments that flood the airwaves and media streams

 

and really, stop with this idiotic labeling of everyone as a liberal if they have a different view to you.

 

but hey, silly fobar. I clearly have no idea whats going on

[Kevbo_Jones]

It wasn't just the liberal media. LIke i said Fox news did some reports on it.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

 

They all suck either way.

 

And the comment on the plant was plain retarded imo. He acted as if Obama's policies had a chance to save the plant and they didn't. Obama said a plant like that would stay open under his policies and you can't save a company like that in 4 months (if they really did close in April.) That specific plant was long gone before Obama had a chance for his policies to effect it (not saying they would either.) It was a blatant attempt to throw Obama under the bus and he got called out on it. Tough ****.

 

 

**** Obama - really hope i don't get sick in the next 4 years if he's elected.

 

**** ROmney - seems War happy and very shady as a business man.

 

You're wasting your breath but I do agree with your closing statement.

[fobar]

cmon' date=' these days a lie is really just when one side disagrees and refuses to acknowledge whatever you say....and yeah, both sides do that. Thats why its up to us to be better educated and insightful to whats going on and not rely on what they say but rather what they do.[/quote']

I would rather have real facts and truth than stupidity and lies that is the norm for politicians these days

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

What has romney ever done to be shady?

 

 

I love it how on one hand some people (not pointing the finger at you, steeler) wanna paint romney as being too mild, disconnected, suburban milquetoast for todays world, and then turn around and accuse him of being some shady, evil corporate bastard,

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

I would rather have real facts and truth than stupidity and lies that is the norm for politicians these days

 

facts according to whom? what Obama & the MSM say? or what Romney & Fox news say?

[KINGnoob]

It wasn't just the liberal media. LIke i said Fox news did some reports on it.

 

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

 

They all suck either way.

 

And the comment on the plant was plain retarded imo. He acted as if Obama's policies had a chance to save the plant and they didn't. Obama said a plant like that would stay open under his policies and you can't save a company like that in 4 months (if they really did close in April.) That specific plant was long gone before Obama had a chance for his policies to effect it (not saying they would either.) It was a blatant attempt to throw Obama under the bus and he got called out on it. Tough ****.

 

 

**** Obama - really hope i don't get sick in the next 4 years if he's elected.

 

**** ROmney - seems War happy and very shady as a business man.

 

Fair enough.

 

Ryan didn't act like obamas policies had a chance to save the plant, Obama acted like obamas policies had a chance to save the plant. And if it had no chance long before Obama came along then it was dumb of Obama to leave false hope in those workers. But again false hope is what he ran on.

 

If Obama promised those workers that under him they would have still have that plant then it just goes to show how out of touch and out of his league he is.

 

And Ryan as you can see was telling the truth. So he didn't get called out on anything. It just going to back fire on the left now. Tough **** you are right.

[Kevbo_Jones]

the only part I need to read is this. you have failed to miss the point again. I have clearly stated before that I have grown disgusted at the lies of politics. did I pick a side' date=' no. i just highlight what you havent, the lies from the other side.

 

its ok to continually knock Obama, i dont really care about that. just pointing to everyone telling such blatant lies is making more and more people turned off to politics.

 

would be nice to have some truth about how they are really going to work when in office, instead of the stupid he said/ he said arguments that flood the airwaves and media streams

 

and really, stop with this idiotic labeling of everyone as a liberal if they have a different view to you.

 

but hey, silly fobar. I clearly have no idea whats going on [/quote']

 

Sheeple don't want truth as evidenced in my thread about the federal reserve audit... Not one response and people should honestly be outraged by it. Especially people like BJJ who always complain about bailouts and taxes. Neverming that the fed bailed out international banks at the toon of $16 trillion at 0% interest when the banks had no intentions of ever paying it back. Stupid is as stupid does.

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

What has romney ever done to be shady?

 

 

I love it how on one hand some people (not pointing the finger at you' date=' steeler) wanna paint romney as being too mild, disconnected, suburban milquetoast for todays world, and then turn around and accuse him of being some shady, evil corporate bastard,[/quote']

 

I will tell you this, I think ROmeny has a slightly better chance at fixing the economy than Obama does but other than that everything else scares me. Obamas **** scares me too.

 

Thats why im taking the stance of let **** run its course. If i was forced into a voting booth i would vote for Romney but at this point im saying **** it.

[Kevbo_Jones]

What has Romney ever done that was shady? How about speaking out against federal handouts yet taking one to save Bain Capital? He talks out of the side of his mouth constantly...

[fobar]

facts according to whom? what Obama & the MSM say? or what Romney & Fox news say?

You seriously asking that question lol its obvious what i want. I want people to tell the truth for once and not resort to the lies about each other

 

stick to telling me what you are actually going to do. if I want to hear what the other guy is thinking, I will listne to him. I dont need Romney telling me what Obama is thinking, same goes for Obama

 

to much bs and not enough truth

[fobar]

Sheeple don't want truth as evidenced in my thread about the federal reserve audit... Not one response and people should honestly be outraged by it. Especially people like BJJ who always complain about bailouts and taxes. Neverming that the fed bailed out international banks at the toon of $16 trillion at 0% interest when the banks had no intentions of ever paying it back. Stupid is as stupid does.

I try not to get involved in these discussion as they have a one track mode of thinking that everyone is a liberal and stoopid if they dont agree.

 

Yes, the bank bailout was a masterstroke really, what could possibly go wrong?

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

I will tell you this' date=' I think ROmeny has a slightly better chance at fixing the economy than Obama does but other than that everything else scares me. Obamas **** scares me too.

 

Thats why im taking the stance of let **** run its course. If i was forced into a voting booth i would vote for Romney but at this point im saying **** it.[/quote']

 

 

What else exactly scares you about Mitt? I'm not saying hes my ideal guy by any measure, but Obama is a catastrophe in every sense of the word.

 

 

You seriously asking that question lol its obvious what i want. I want people to tell the truth for once and not resort to the lies about each other

 

stick to telling me what you are actually going to do. if I want to hear what the other guy is thinking' date=' I will listne to him. I dont need Romney telling me what Obama is thinking, same goes for Obama

 

to much bs and not enough truth[/quote']

 

Thats the problem, they all spin & talk about things in their own way, and alot of it is very subjective. You have to understand for yourself what the truth is and cipher from what they say whether they are A) know what they are talking about, and then telling the truth about it.

 

 

Just FYI - I think what BJJ & I are having a laugh about is that you really seem hung up on pointing the finger @ romney, yet ignoring obama. why is that?

[KINGnoob]

First off I would have appreciated it if you responded to my first post considering this post was more of a cheer toward DL's doing the hard researching. But i could understand why you would skip commenting on it.

 

the only part I need to read is this. you have failed to miss the point again. I have clearly stated before that I have grown disgusted at the lies of politics. did I pick a side, no. i just highlight what you havent, the lies from the other side.

 

Im down with calling Ryan and Romney out on anything and everything. I would just appreciate the same treatment toward Obama. See I dont think leftists are "happy" with Obama but they arnt willing to go no holds barred against him though. Sure you may dislike both parties but you are obviously more uncomfortable going after Obama.

 

its ok to continually knock Obama, i dont really care about that. just pointing to everyone telling such blatant lies is making more and more people turned off to politics.

 

I would also hope you do the same on Obama. Thats all I ask actually.

 

would be nice to have some truth about how they are really going to work when in office, instead of the stupid he said/ he said arguments that flood the airwaves and media streams

 

Well lucky for you Romney put it in a book. Enjoy. And its free, my favorite price.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Believe-America-Romneys-Economic-ebook/dp/B005LEY5Q0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1346697347&sr=8-1&keywords=romney+economic+plan

 

and really, stop with this idiotic labeling of everyone as a liberal if they have a different view to you.

 

Fair point except that when we debated back in my Capitalism threads you tended to disagree. Which led me to believe you are a lefty. I apologize and you can go ahead and correct and let me know what you are then. Theres tests on the internet that will guide you if you cant define it.

 

but hey, silly fobar. I clearly have no idea whats going on

 

Ok, i'll apologize i shouldn't of said silly fobar. Because I dont think you have no idea whats going on. I do however believe you highly dislike the right far more than you do the left. So you right away have an instant attack motive for the right. Im not saying thats bad, but you try and claim to be neutral which is where my concern lies with you. I dont like that. Its a dodge of sorts. You get all the ability to attack and none of the responsibility.

 

Edit: fixed bolded

[KINGnoob]

Sheeple don't want truth as evidenced in my thread about the federal reserve audit... Not one response and people should honestly be outraged by it. Especially people like BJJ who always complain about bailouts and taxes. Neverming that the fed bailed out international banks at the toon of $16 trillion at 0% interest when the banks had no intentions of ever paying it back. Stupid is as stupid does.

 

Wheres this thread. And Im down with shutting down the fed. I was watching that one video you posted that was an hour long but i got gf agro really bad and she thinks that ***** stupid. Its a great video so far. Ill finish it later.

 

I just read an article in the AP where Bernanke said that historically the Fed has jjust controlled interests rates. And even though they are at all time low now its not working to help the economy. So he said hes going to do "more" wtf does that even mean?

 

Im sure we agree when it comes to the fed Kevbo.

[fobar]

Thats the problem' date=' they all spin & talk about things in their own way, and alot of it is very subjective. You have to understand for yourself what the truth is and cipher from what they say whether they are A) know what they are talking about, and then telling the truth about it.

 

 

Just FYI - I think what BJJ & I are having a laugh about is that you really seem hung up on pointing the finger @ romney, yet ignoring obama. why is that?[/quote']

For the first part, I have already said thats why people are getting sick and tired of politics.

 

second part, you and BJJ have made countless threads knocking Obama, I make one thread about this guy and I'm hung up on pointing the finger at romney lmfao

 

and you claim others dont read things properly

 

I have stated clearly in this thread I am sick of all of politics, but carry on thinking what you like.

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

 

 

Im down with calling Ryan and Romney out on anything and everything. I would just appreciate the same treatment toward Obama. See I dont think leftists are "happy" with Obama but they arnt willing to go no holds barred against him though. Sure you may dislike both parties but you are obviously more uncomfortable going after Obama.

 

 

 

I would also hope you do the same on Obama. Thats all I ask actually.

 

 

 

 

 

 

^^^ this

 

I like you fobar and you know I am always sincere and honest with you, even when we disagree. But, BJJ is right when he says this, you do seem peculiarly one sides in alot of your concerns about politics, or at least in terms of obama vs the right wing.

[KINGnoob]

For the first part' date=' I have already said thats why people are getting sick and tired of politics.

 

second part, you and BJJ have made countless threads knocking Obama, I make one thread about this guy and I'm hung up on pointing the finger at romney lmfao

 

and you claim others dont read things properly

 

I have stated clearly in this thread I am sick of all of politics, but carry on thinking what you like.[/quote']

 

The only reason i didnt point out his "Gm lies" is because within the day of hearing about them i also found it to be true. So why would i make a thread about it?

 

But honestly this is what the debates/interviews are for. I hope this **** gets brought up. Ryan needs to to all of them too. Not just Fox. He should even do the view :eek:

[fobar]

Ok' date=' i'll apologize i shouldn't of said silly fobar. Because I dont think you have no idea whats going on. I do however believe you highly dislike the right far more than you do the right. So you right away have an instant attack motive for the right. Im not saying thats bad, but you try and claim to be neutral which is where my concern lies with you. I dont like that. Its a dodge of sorts. You get all the ability to attack and none of the responsibility.[/quote']

Seriously re read what I have written here please. I have stated I am disgusted with all politics and have been for a long time I might add.

 

I havent got a side, because the option are not much different and the difference makes no better circumstance for the world I live in.

 

Please, stop labeling people that disagree with you as liberals. Stop thinking because I disagree with certain issues I have an agenda against the right. Just continually open your eyes to the world around you and not just the right or left, but every available information source you can get your hands on to educate yourself to make the best choice possible

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

The only reason i didnt point out his "Gm lies" is because within the day of hearing about them i also found it to be true. So why would i make a thread about it?

 

But honestly this is what the debates/interviews are for. I hope this **** gets brought up. Ryan needs to to all of them too. Not just Fox. He should even do the view :eek:

 

Ryans has been on MSNBC quite a bit, and holds his own just fine, even though I think he could stand to be a bit more assertive now. Unlike Obama, he doesnt fear opposition media. I would like mitt to do the same thing, but Im not hip to his prior media appearances so I'm not sure if hes ever gone into hostile territory or not.

 

Funny how the View always attacks the right wing folks, and then laps up & kisses anyone from the left's *** Only Bill O has been able to tame them through his charm

[KINGnoob]

Seriously re read what I have written here please. I have stated I am disgusted with all politics and have been for a long time I might add.

 

I havent got a side' date=' because the option are not much different and the difference makes no better circumstance for the world I live in.

 

Please, stop labeling people that disagree with you as liberals. Stop thinking because I disagree with certain issues I have an agenda against the right. Just continually open your eyes to the world around you and not just the right or left, but every available information source you can get your hands on to educate yourself to make the best choice possible[/quote']

 

My claims toward you have everything to do with my experiences with you on this forum. If im wrong then you are painting the wrong picture of yourself. I would put money though that if you vote you vote to the left of the line.

 

I will though try not to go right to labeling. Its a weakness i guess.

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

What else exactly scares you about Mitt? I'm not saying hes my ideal guy by any measure' date=' but Obama is a catastrophe in every sense of the word.

 

 

Thats the problem, they all spin & talk about things in their own way, and alot of it is very subjective. You have to understand for yourself what the truth is and cipher from what they say whether they are A) know what they are talking about, and then telling the truth about it.

 

 

Just FYI - I think what BJJ & I are having a laugh about is that you really seem hung up on pointing the finger @ romney, yet ignoring obama. why is that?[/quote']

 

You don't think conservatives do the same exact thing? Its a 2 way street my friend.

 

Also this thread will naturally get more Romney criticism becase its pointing out a problem in his vice president. Its solely based on them, has nothing to do with Obama. Besides the fact that i already said i hate Obama too.

 

 

 

Romney scares me for many reasons....

 

1. He makes it seems like he's gonna muscle every country around. His foreign policy is scary as **** and imo he's a little war happy.

 

2. He's flip flopped way too much. Ive seen some of the ******** that comes out of his mouth.

 

3. Ive seen him do a 1 on 1 interaction to someone with cerebral palsy and literally turned a cold shoulder to him because he was talking about something ROmney was scared to talk about.

 

4. While i believe the accusations of his company Bain is mostly misinformation and skewed facts, it is something to keep an eye on. There's still something semi fishy there.

 

 

 

THere's 3 major reasons why i would vote for him over Obama.

 

1. Like i said already, i think he has the business credentials to maybe know how to fix the economy and little better.

 

2. He says he plans to become self reliant on fuel sources by 2020...which would create a **** load of new jobs and we won't have to deal with the overseas ********. If thats even doable at this point, that would be amazing.

 

3. If he truly gets rid of the healthcare ******** Obama put into play. But then again, Obama healthcare is just an extension of what Romney did in Mass.

 

All that is contingent on he not just blowing smoke up our *** to get elected too. Which it seems he's willing to do.

[KINGnoob]

Ryans has been on MSNBC quite a bit' date=' and holds his own just fine, even though I think he could stand to be a bit more assertive now. Unlike Obama, he doesnt fear opposition media. I would like mitt to do the same thing, but Im not hip to his prior media appearances so I'm not sure if hes ever gone into hostile territory or not.

 

Funny how the View always attacks the right wing folks, and then laps up & kisses anyone from the left's *** Only Bill O has been able to tame them through his charm[/quote']

 

Yup. Thats why they are terrified. They know its going to be hard to trap him.

[fobar]

My claims toward you have everything to do with my experiences with you on this forum. If im wrong then you are painting the wrong picture of yourself. I would put money though that if you vote you vote to the left of the line.

 

I will though try not to go right to labeling. Its a weakness i guess.

That says a lot about yourself to form that opinion because we have differences. politics is such a vast topic that a few threads here really shouldn't shape your opinion of others and their views

 

you know it is possible for members of the same party to disagree on many things also, which is why I said calm down on the labeling. I dont vote for left or right, just the person that makes the most sense to me or I dont vote at all.

 

to pick a side and stick to it is not a sensible position to be in IMO. I just listen to what they have to see, research as much as possible and try and make the most informed choice I can.

 

And if we disagree on a subject, then we disagree. dosent mean I am left or right, I just have a different view on things

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

You don't think conservatives do the same exact thing? Its a 2 way street my friend.

 

Also this thread will naturally get more Romney criticism becase its pointing out a problem in his vice president. Its solely based on them' date=' has nothing to do with Obama. Besides the fact that i already said i hate Obama too.

 

 

 

All that is contingent on he not just blowing smoke up our *** to get elected too. Which it seems he's willing to do.[/quote']

 

Sorry, I'm confused, what exactly were you referring to in saying conservatives do the same thing?

 

As far as VP's go, if thats REALLY where the focus is, then why arent we talking about what a walking & talking, perpetual jackwagon Biden is??? That guy doesnt just gaffe - he talks out of his *** as a 2nd language!

 

As far as smoke screens go, you dont think Obama is gonna blow at least equal amounts of smoke??

[KINGnoob]

You don't think conservatives do the same exact thing? Its a 2 way street my friend.

 

Agreed.

 

Romney scares me for many reasons....

 

1. He makes it seems like he's gonna muscle every country around. His foreign policy is scary as **** and imo he's a little war happy.

 

I dont know if hes war happy. If hes like Bush that would def be a huge ****ing problem. Im a walk softly carry a big stick guy myself. However, im not blind to the fact that most of the world hates us. And that reason alone makes me feel like we need to stay strong militarily. That doesnt mean invade countries. It means keeping the military well armed/trained/technologically savvy. Obama seems to be more for like an all around equality game.

 

2. He's flip flopped way too much. Ive seen some of the ******** that comes out of his mouth.

 

Very true. I dont think that discounts him though. People change their minds. Obama said hes was going to cut the debt in half. Flipped hard on that one.

 

3. Ive seen him do a 1 on 1 interaction to someone with cerebral palsy and literally turned a cold shoulder to him because he was talking about something ROmney was scared to talk about.

 

Rude but not really scary.

 

. While i believe the accusations of his company Bain is mostly misinformation and skewed facts, it is something to keep an eye on. There's still something semi fishy there.

 

Of course it seems fishy they made a lot of money. And no company makes a lot of money in an unfishy way

 

1. Like i said already, i think he has the business credentials to maybe know how to fix the economy and little better.

 

Agreed. The budget being the big one.

 

2. He says he plans to become self reliant on fuel sources by 2020...which would create a **** load of new jobs and we won't have to deal with the overseas ********. If thats even doable at this point, that would be amazing.

 

Yup, hopefully the green freaks dont **** this up.

 

3. If he truly gets rid of the healthcare ******** Obama put into play. But then again, Obama healthcare is just an extension of what Romney did in Mass.

 

It is a Replica of what Romney did, but there is a drastic difference between federal mandates and state mandates. Why did my family move from socal to Las Vegas? Because cost of living is less here. You dont get that luxury with federal mandates.

 

All that is contingent on he not just blowing smoke up our *** to get elected too. Which it seems he's willing to do.

 

If he is, im voting against him next election.

[CyberSlayer]

Theres only one way I would vote for Obama,if he legalizes weed..

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

Theres only one way I would vote for Obama' date='if he legalizes weed..[/quote']

 

http://cdn2.elitedaily.com/elite/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/elite-daily-obama-stoner.jpg

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

 

Also this thread will naturally get more Romney criticism becase its pointing out a problem in his vice president. Its solely based on them' date=' has nothing to do with Obama. Besides the fact that i already said i hate Obama too.

 

 

 

[/quote']

 

So why the double standard??

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/henrymiller/2012/08/20/joe-bidens-gaffes-call-for-a-thorough-neurological-examination/

 

Joe Biden's Gaffes Call For A Thorough Neurological Examination

 

 

There are worse things for a politician than lack of insight ? and the person selected by Barack Obama to be a heartbeat away from the presidency exhibits many of them. Joe Biden has problems with impulse control and reality testing; increasingly, his utterances suggest some sort of dementia.

 

Speculating about deregulatory policies that a Republican administration might adopt, Biden told a crowd in Danville, Virginia last week that Romney ?s approach would ?put y?all back in chains.? That ill-chosen, impulsive remark has led to widespread condemnation, even from Democrats.

 

A few days later the vice president concluded a campaign speech with a rousing, ?With you we can win North Carolina again.? The only problem was, he was in Virginia.

 

Biden has previously done and said impulsive, bizarre things. In 1987, he plagiarized part of a campaign speech from one by Neil Kinnock, leader of Britain?s Labour Party, and even revised his own family history to conform to the speech.

 

Biden has demonstrated poor reality testing ? or a pathological disregard for the truth ? for decades. He claimed in 1987 that he ?went to law school on a full academic scholarship ? the only one in my class to have a full academic scholarship,? and that he ?ended up in the top half? of his class. He also said that in college he was ?the outstanding student in the political science department? and ?graduated with three degrees.?

 

However, after inaccuracies in his statements were exposed, Biden made this admission on September 22, 1987: ?I did not graduate in the top half of my class at law school and my recollection of this was inaccurate.? He had actually graduated 76th in a class of 85 from the Syracuse College of Law. And Biden?s baccalaureate accomplishment was a single B.A. degree.

 

Age appears not to have improved Biden?s connection with reality. During the 2008 presidential campaign, he observed: ?When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on television? and explained it to the American people.

 

Oh, really?

 

In fact, Roosevelt did not become president until 1933 and his first appearance on TV was in 1939. Since that gaffe, Biden, who will be 70 in November, frequently has fumbled and bumbled in his public remarks. And his boss reportedly doesn?t appreciate it. According to the authors of the 2010 book ?Game Change,? Obama asked angrily, ?How many times is Biden gonna say something stupid??

 

Are these aberrations stupidity, dementia or personality disorders? To find out, shouldn?t there be some vetting or testing of people in, or who aspire to, governmental positions as critical as the vice-presidency? After all, we require bus drivers and hairdressers to prove their competence before they are permitted to ply their trades, and applicants to most police forces undergo psychological testing.

 

Biden should submit to a thorough neurological and psychiatric examination, with special attention to whether he is experiencing ?transient ischemic attacks? ? marked by impaired blood flow to the brain ? small strokes, seizures, or suffers from a brain tumor. After all, we often demand to know whether a candidate has recovered from open-heart surgery, cancer or a stroke, and many states require elderly drivers to be re-licensed.

 

Aren?t the vice-president?s highest-level security clearance and his influence on public policy as important as the ability to drive a car?

 

An exam by an expert offers an assessment of cognitive abilities, memory and quality of thought processes. It includes assessments of alertness; speech; behavior; awareness of environment; mood; affect; rationality of thought processes; appropriateness of thought content (presence of delusions, hallucinations, or phobias); memory; ability to perform simple calculations; judgement (?If you found a letter on the ground in front of a mailbox, what would you do with it??); and abstract reasoning.

 

Don?t voters have a right to know whether Biden is ill or merely unlikeable, impulsive and prone to deceitfulness?

 

Henry I. Miller, a physician, is the Robert Wesson Fellow in Scientific Philosophy and Public Policy at Stanford University?s Hoover Institution.

[Kevbo_Jones]

Wheres this thread. And Im down with shutting down the fed. I was watching that one video you posted that was an hour long but i got gf agro really bad and she thinks that ***** stupid. Its a great video so far. Ill finish it later.

 

I just read an article in the AP where Bernanke said that historically the Fed has jjust controlled interests rates. And even though they are at all time low now its not working to help the economy. So he said hes going to do "more" wtf does that even mean?

 

Im sure we agree when it comes to the fed Kevbo.

 

http://forums.ufc.production.sparkart.net/showthread.php?t=125530

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

So why the double standard??

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/henrymiller/2012/08/20/joe-bidens-gaffes-call-for-a-thorough-neurological-examination/

 

Joe Biden's Gaffes Call For A Thorough Neurological Examination

 

 

There are worse things for a politician than lack of insight – and the person selected by Barack Obama to be a heartbeat away from the presidency exhibits many of them. Joe Biden has problems with impulse control and reality testing; increasingly' date=' his utterances suggest some sort of dementia.

 

Speculating about deregulatory policies that a Republican administration might adopt, Biden told a crowd in Danville, Virginia last week that Romney ‘s approach would “put y’all back in chains.” That ill-chosen, impulsive remark has led to widespread condemnation, even from Democrats.

 

A few days later the vice president concluded a campaign speech with a rousing, “With you we can win North Carolina again.” The only problem was, he was in Virginia.

 

Biden has previously done and said impulsive, bizarre things. In 1987, he plagiarized part of a campaign speech from one by Neil Kinnock, leader of Britain’s Labour Party, and even revised his own family history to conform to the speech.

 

Biden has demonstrated poor reality testing – or a pathological disregard for the truth – for decades. He claimed in 1987 that he ”went to law school on a full academic scholarship — the only one in my class to have a full academic scholarship,” and that he ”ended up in the top half” of his class. He also said that in college he was ”the outstanding student in the political science department” and ”graduated with three degrees.”

 

However, after inaccuracies in his statements were exposed, Biden made this admission on September 22, 1987: ”I did not graduate in the top half of my class at law school and my recollection of this was inaccurate.” He had actually graduated 76th in a class of 85 from the Syracuse College of Law. And Biden’s baccalaureate accomplishment was a single B.A. degree.

 

Age appears not to have improved Biden’s connection with reality. During the 2008 presidential campaign, he observed: “When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on television” and explained it to the American people.

 

Oh, really?

 

In fact, Roosevelt did not become president until 1933 and his first appearance on TV was in 1939. Since that gaffe, Biden, who will be 70 in November, frequently has fumbled and bumbled in his public remarks. And his boss reportedly doesn’t appreciate it. According to the authors of the 2010 book “Game Change,” Obama asked angrily, “How many times is Biden gonna say something stupid?”

 

Are these aberrations stupidity, dementia or personality disorders? To find out, shouldn’t there be some vetting or testing of people in, or who aspire to, governmental positions as critical as the vice-presidency? After all, we require bus drivers and hairdressers to prove their competence before they are permitted to ply their trades, and applicants to most police forces undergo psychological testing.

 

Biden should submit to a thorough neurological and psychiatric examination, with special attention to whether he is experiencing “transient ischemic attacks” – marked by impaired blood flow to the brain – small strokes, seizures, or suffers from a brain tumor. After all, we often demand to know whether a candidate has recovered from open-heart surgery, cancer or a stroke, and many states require elderly drivers to be re-licensed.

 

Aren’t the vice-president’s highest-level security clearance and his influence on public policy as important as the ability to drive a car?

 

An exam by an expert offers an assessment of cognitive abilities, memory and quality of thought processes. It includes assessments of alertness; speech; behavior; awareness of environment; mood; affect; rationality of thought processes; appropriateness of thought content (presence of delusions, hallucinations, or phobias); memory; ability to perform simple calculations; judgement (“If you found a letter on the ground in front of a mailbox, what would you do with it?”); and abstract reasoning.

 

[b']Don’t voters have a right to know whether Biden is ill or merely unlikeable, impulsive and prone to deceitfulness?[/b]

 

Henry I. Miller, a physician, is the Robert Wesson Fellow in Scientific Philosophy and Public Policy at Stanford University’s Hoover Institution.

 

This is why i hate discussing things with you lol.

you go so off topic

 

Its not a double standard, Its the ****ing topic man.

 

We're not talking about Biden. If you want to create that discussion make another thread!

[CyberSlayer]

This is why i hate discussing things with you lol.

you go so off topic

 

Its not a double standard' date=' Its the ****ing topic man.

 

We're not talking about Biden. If you want to create that discussion make another thread![/quote']

 

Oooh wee child things are gonna get easier,ooh wee child things will get brighter..

[DL4TRU_STRENGTH]

This is why i hate discussing things with you lol.

you go so off topic

 

Its not a double standard' date=' Its the ****ing topic man.

 

We're not talking about Biden. If you want to create that discussion make another thread![/quote']

 

Just because I bring facts of relevancy that destroy the paradigm of the thread doesnt mean I am derailing it

 

 

Just curious, why arent the merits of both VP's on the table? Ive spent alot of time on poli forums and this is the first time I have ever encountered anyone presuming to narrow the focus of the discussion in this manner.

[Kevbo_Jones]

This is why i hate discussing things with you lol.

you go so off topic

 

Its not a double standard' date=' Its the ****ing topic man.

 

We're not talking about Biden. If you want to create that discussion make another thread![/quote']

 

Dude's got his Faux News blinders and ear plugs in. It's pointless to even respond.

[CyberSlayer]

Oooh wee child things are gonna get easier' date='ooh wee child things will get brighter..[/quote']

 

Someday yeah, we'll put it together and we'll get it undone,

Someday when your head is much lighter,

Someday yeah, we'll walk in the raise of a beautiful sun,

Someday when the world is much brighter,

[Kevbo_Jones]

Just because I bring facts of relevancy that destroy the paradigm of the thread doesnt mean I am derailing it

 

 

Just curious' date=' why arent the merits of both VP's on the table? Ive spent alot of time on poli forums and this is the first time I have ever encountered anyone presuming to narrow the focus of the discussion in this manner.[/quote']

 

Translation: I argue my viewpoints A LOT in various places and will not budge from my preconceived notions.

[Pigs-On-The-Wing]

Just because I bring facts of relevancy that destroy the paradigm of the thread doesnt mean I am derailing it

 

 

Just curious' date=' why arent the merits of both VP's on the table? Ive spent alot of time on poli forums and this is the first time I have ever encountered anyone presuming to narrow the focus of the discussion in this manner.[/quote']

of course its derailing the topic.

 

We're talking about what Ryan has said recently. Strictly on what he's done.

 

I don't care about comparisons. If they both suck they both suck, thats not gonna change.

 

We're not talking about Biden because 1. he's already the VP and 2. Ryan is new to a lot of people and we're trying to figure out what he's about.

[fobar]

of course its derailing the topic.

 

We're talking about what Ryan has said recently. Strictly on what he's done.

 

I don't care about comparisons. If they both suck they both suck' date=' thats not gonna change.

 

We're not talking about Biden because 1. he's already the VP and 2. Ryan is new to a lot of people and we're trying to figure out what he's about.[/quote']

Remember that if he says he isnt derailing a thread then he isnt derailing a thread. Even tho he will discuss anything and everything within the thread to suit his own agenda, he is still not derailing the thread