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AxeMurduh

Another Shooting.....

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Considering that the US has at least 200% more people than the next closest country on that meme' date=' I'd say some people need to learn ratios.[/quote']

 

Dude, take your own advice and research a little... see what happens when you do take ratios in to it... the result is, the US has a MUCH higher murder rate than those countries. It's not just some meme... you are really weird sometimes...

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Does the 2nd amendment specifically state everyone has a right to own guns or to bare arms? Because that was written at a time when guns were pretty much the only option. Nowadays there are plenty on non lethal alternatives' date=' live Tasers, mace, flashbangs.

 

If tasers and mace are good enough for law enforcement as protection, why not ban guns and let concerned citizens use non lethal weapons. I mean they are only for self defence right? A tazer will stop someone dead in their tracks, and very unlikely to kill an innocent bystander yet still provide someone with adequate protection.

 

So, to all those in favour of protecting yourself, why not swap to a non lethal alternative?[/quote']

 

Law Enforcement also has guns. The problem with both tasers and mace is the range is not effective against an assailent armed with a gun and mace is pretty ineffective against even an unarmed assailent. People on drugs such as PCP or simply someone wearing thick clothing can negate tasers.

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But it is the first thing most cops go for, and they are trained professionals. how about a couple of flash grenades kept in the house, those will definitely stun any intruders and give you time enough to escape or to subdue them.

 

And people resisting tasers is very rare and in 99% of most cases would be sufficient enough to protect ones self. You do not have to kill someone to stop attacking you. Hell even a baseball bat would be better than a gun.

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But it is the first thing most cops go for' date=' and they are trained professionals.[/quote']

 

Cops go for this more because of the ramifications of what happens if they shoot someone.

 

 

its a last resort the pistol

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Cops go for this more because of the ramifications of what happens if they shoot someone.

 

 

its a last resort the pistol

 

Then that is a good example for the public to follow. There is no excuse to warrant needing a gun in this day and age when there are plenty of non lethal alternatives unless you simply WANT to kill someone or to feel like a badass.

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But it is the first thing most cops go for' date=' and they are trained professionals. how about a couple of flash grenades kept in the house, those will definitely stun any intruders and give you time enough to escape or to subdue them.

 

And people resisting tasers is very rare and in 99% of most cases would be sufficient enough to protect ones self. You do not have to kill someone to stop attacking you. Hell even a baseball bat would be better than a gun.[/quote']

 

If the assailent is armed with a gun a taser is not the first thing cops go for. If several criminals break into your home armed with guns a flashbang, dog, bat, knife, taser, mace isn't going to cut it.

 

On tasers being 99% effective you just made that stat up. I've seen half a dozen cop shows they tried to tase someone in colder climates and the suspect had a thick puffy jacket with layered clothing underneath and it simply didn't work and the effective maximum range for almost all of them is 25 feet.

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Dude' date=' take your own advice and research a little... see what happens when you do take ratios in to it... the result is, the US has a MUCH higher murder rate than those countries. It's not just some meme... you are really weird sometimes...[/quote']

 

It's actually not...

 

 

Historically speaking in per capita, meaning firearm deaths per 100,000 people, there is 11 countries higher than the US. El Salvador is number 1 with a rate of 50.36 all attributed to homicide. The US is number 12 with a rate of 9.0. 2.98 is attributed to homicide, 5.75 to suicide, and .27 to uniformed reaction(police).

 

This is probably why you do what you do for work and I do what I do for work...

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It's actually not...

 

 

Historically speaking in per capita' date=' meaning firearm deaths per 100,000 people, there is 11 countries higher than the US. El Salvador is number 1 with a rate of 50.36 all attributed to homicide. The US is number 12 with a rate of 9.0. 2.98 is attributed to homicide, 5.75 to suicide, and .27 to uniformed reaction(police).

 

This is probably why you do what you do for work and I do what I do for work...[/quote']

 

Actually, it is...

First off El Salvador isn't even on that "meme", why are you bringing them up?

 

Like I said... weird...

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As far as policy here's mine.

 

Im no badass but if you break into my home armed with a gun im going to assume you'll use it and im going to try to take you out before you get me.

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If's and buts' date=' more like excuses. Just admit you want a gun to feel tough.[/quote']

 

It's not about being tough that's your words not mine. A person that is not tough can still pull a trigger. That's the point. If a criminal might have a gun why should i be deprived.

 

That's not if and's or buts that's reality and i have the right to own a gun and protect myself, my property and family.

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As far as policy here's mine.

 

Im no badass but if you break into my home armed with a gun im going to assume you'll use it and im going to try to take you out before you get me.

 

So what if someone breaks into your house unarmed? You still think shooting them is acceptable?

 

You have the right to bare arms, it does not specifically state gun. Laws can change without changing an outdated declaration. it is only a matter of time.

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Actually' date=' it is...

First off El Salvador isn't even on that "meme", why are you bringing them up?

 

Like I said... weird...[/quote']

 

Oh, so we are basing this conversation on a random anti-gun internet meme and not historical data? I guess you win then. :rolleyes:

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So what if someone breaks into your house unarmed? You still think shooting them is acceptable?

 

Some people might but i wouldn't kill them. If they didn't comply and tried to rush me shot in the leg they will be.

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So what if someone breaks into your house unarmed? You still think shooting them is acceptable?

 

You have the right to bare arms' date=' laws can change without changing an outdated declaration. it is only a matter of time.[/quote']

 

Lmao!!! How can you assume a person breaking into your house is unarmed? That's border level insanely naive. Common sense would dictate that a person who breaks into occupied property is either A) armed, or B) completely retarded(although this option still applies if A is a variable).

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I personally dont think America should be looking at 3rd world countries and take their cues for "look how many less deaths we have than them"

 

 

we arent them. We are developed and life holds more value.

 

I have live in 3 3rd world countries and YES life is valued less.

 

I dont mean by they value their lives less but murders happen regularly and it becomes a situation of "oh well, just another murder"

 

I believe we are better than this

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Lmao!!! How can you assume a person breaking into your house is unarmed? That's border level insanely naive. Common sense would dictate that a person who breaks into occupied property is either A) armed' date=' or B) completely retarded(although this option still applies if A is a variable).[/quote']

 

Or just a stoned kid looking to steal a playstation to pay for weed. Not entirely thinking straight. Does he deserve to be shot too?

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Or just a stoned kid looking to steal a playstation to pay for weed. Not entirely thinking straight. Does he deserve to be shot too?

 

People really steal to buy weed :confused:

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Or just a stoned kid looking to steal a playstation to pay for weed. Not entirely thinking straight. Does he deserve to be shot too?

 

Yes it would teach him to buy his own playstation and weed. PS3 is no joke step your game up! :P

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Lmao!!! How can you assume a person breaking into your house is unarmed? That's border level insanely naive. Common sense would dictate that a person who breaks into occupied property is either A) armed' date=' or B) completely retarded(although this option still applies if A is a variable).[/quote']

 

I personally dont think America should be looking at 3rd world countries and take their cues for "look how many less deaths we have than them"

 

 

we arent them. We are developed and life holds more value.

 

I have live in 3 3rd world countries and YES life is valued less.

 

I dont mean by they value their lives less but murders happen regularly and it becomes a situation of "oh well' date=' just another murder"

 

I believe we are better than this[/quote']

 

Or just a stoned kid looking to steal a playstation to pay for weed. Not entirely thinking straight. Does he deserve to be shot too?

 

I think you above all other would understand what addiction can drive somebody too.

 

Now waiting for a ban for that :)

 

Addiction... Weed... Does not compute... Keep trying buddy.

 

 

 

 

site_28_rand_1602436206_water_627.jpg

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I think you above all other would understand what addiction can drive somebody too.

 

Now waiting for a ban for that :)

 

LOL Reefer Madness

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Oh' date=' so we are basing this conversation on a random anti-gun internet meme and not historical data? I guess you win then. :rolleyes:[/quote']

 

Come on Kev, don't take on your DL4 persona now... Like I said, forget the anti-gun part and just look at the murder statistics of the countries in that meme. I'm not saying that America is the worst by any means, but it's definitely one of the worst when you compare it to supposedly "civilized", countries. Like I said, the murder rate is higher than most of the "uncivilized", countries in the middle east that Americans think they are so much better than. Food for though or are you just going to continue being weird/DL4? :confused:

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I personally dont think America should be looking at 3rd world countries and take their cues for "look how many less deaths we have than them"

 

 

we arent them. We are developed and life holds more value.

 

I have live in 3 3rd world countries and YES life is valued less.

 

I dont mean by they value their lives less but murders happen regularly and it becomes a situation of "oh well' date=' just another murder"

 

I believe we are better than this[/quote']

 

This was my point, but Kev is in his stubborn mode.

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I think you above all other would understand what addiction can drive somebody too.

 

Now waiting for a ban for that :)

 

I've never seen someone soo addicted to weed they'd break in someone's place to steal something unless they're the kind of person to do it without being addicted to anything.

 

Here's the thing though. You raised a point i wanted to get at. Most home invasions are drug addicts and some of them do kill the victims with guns, knives whatever. If druggie criminals can use guns to rob and kill me i have the right to defend myself and prevent it.

 

You, anyone else and my governement are not going to take my guns away and that's that.

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LOL Reefer Madness

 

Dude is out to lunch and should smoke a joint. He'd feel like a right nimrod for saying that afterwards.

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I've never seen someone soo addicted to weed they'd break in someone's place to steal something unless they're the kind of person to do it without being addicted to anything.

 

Here's the thing though. You raised a point i wanted to get at. Most home invasions are drug addicts and some of them do kill the victims with guns' date=' knives whatever. If druggie criminals can use guns to rob and kill me i have the right to defend myself and prevent it.

 

You, anyone else and my governement are not going to take my guns away and that's that.[/quote']

 

You don't have to be addicted to something to steal something to pay for it.

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Come on Kev' date=' don't take on your DL4 persona now... Like I said, forget the anti-gun part and just look at the [u']murder[/u] statistics of the countries in that meme. I'm not saying that America is the worst by any means, but it's definitely one of the worst when you compare it to supposedly "civilized", countries. Like I said, the murder rate is higher than most of the "uncivilized", countries in the middle east that Americans think they are so much better than. Food for though or are you just going to continue being weird/DL4? :confused:

 

Even if you use only the meme, based on population, the difference is still pretty insignificant. Yes, the US is a violent country that promotes violent culture but it isn't the rootin tootin wild west. Ratios work by comparing pool sizes. The number for the US looks much larger, and is when compared to say, Canada. But when you factor in that Canada has a population of roughly 37,000,000+ and the US has a population of 350,000,000+ it will make sense.

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Wow.

 

^this

 

All sides enough with the personal attacks ..

 

If anyone needs a cooling off period I can assist you.

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This was my point' date=' but Kev is in his stubborn mode.[/quote']

 

Which is a point I agree with, but using math as your example doesn't quite drive home the same message. It's not nearly as significant as you think. Furthermore, I do not advocate attacking the Constitution or Bill of Rights in order to achieve this.

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Even if you use only the meme' date=' based on population, the difference is still pretty insignificant. Yes, the US is a violent country that promotes violent culture but it isn't the rootin tootin wild west. Ratios work by comparing pool sizes. The number for the US looks much larger, and is when compared to say, Canada. But when you factor in that Canada has a population of roughly 37,000,000+ and the US has a population of 350,000,000+ it will make sense.[/quote']

 

Sigh... lazy ***...

 

Murder per 100,000

 

US = 5.22

UK = 1.57

Switzerland = .72 I really love how gun nut jobs love to compare these people to the US. :rolleyes:

 

You can finish the rest, I'm not doing ALL the work for you. :rolleyes:

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You don't have to be addicted to something to steal something to pay for it.

 

Never said you did. I even said.....

 

"I've never seen someone soo addicted to weed they'd break in someone's place to steal something unless they're the kind of person to do it without being addicted to anything."

 

Weed is not like that. Things like Crack, Meth, Heroine, Synthetic Heroine certain pills etc. can turn otherwise ordinarly decent people into scumbags that would rob thier own folks to get thier fix.

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Sigh... lazy ***...

 

Murder per 100' date='000

 

US = 5.22

UK = 1.57

Switzerland = .72 I really love how gun nut jobs love to compare these people to the US. :rolleyes:

 

You can finish the rest, I'm not doing ALL the work for you. :rolleyes:[/quote']

 

How exactly are you coming to that figure? I'm not necessarily saying I disagree but I need to know what your factors are. They don't seem to jive with either my math or actual statistical data that is published.

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"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.

 

It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed

people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

 

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

 

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

 

222382_508875815802149_830677815_n.jpg

 

Morgan Freeman ladies and gentlemen.

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@Moal^^ already been posted and i agree.

 

Sigh... lazy ***...

 

Murder per 100' date='000

 

US = 5.22

UK = 1.57

Switzerland = .72 I really love how gun nut jobs love to compare these people to the US. :rolleyes:

 

You can finish the rest, I'm not doing ALL the work for you. :rolleyes:[/quote']

 

I think there are too many variables to compare directly without acknowledging there are other factors and variables. Murder per 100,000 is pretty broad and not specific at all.

 

England is it's own island. US shares a border with violent mexican drug cartels and has massive drug problems across the whole nation. Guns are prevalent in the states and it is indeed typically more likely to be murdered by a gun than knife or whatever.

 

That's just two variables that aren't really accounted for off the top of my head and with bigger population numbers there are going to be more varying circumstances not factored in that might not paint the picture too accurately.

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How exactly are you coming to that figure? I'm not necessarily saying I disagree but I need to know what your factors are. They don't seem to jive with either my math or actual statistical data that is published.

 

So I ask you Kev, if all evidence points that your archaic laws about gun ownership are like mentioned and the per capita is so lop sided compared to developed nations not being run by drug cartels and the likes. Would you support a ban on assault weapons (I say this because I don't believe for a second you would ever say you would agree to removing weapons as a right to defence, hunting, sport etc.

 

I ask because the second amendment was to stop the government from tyranny, but even with an AK in your hands, your not going to stop the tanks, stealths or drones. Yet you as citizens are not allowed to own them for protection. So assault rifles do very little against current ability for tyranny, but do one hell of a job of killing off innocent citizens.

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The guy had a semi automatic weapon with hundreds of bullets, two pistols and another weapon in the car.

 

There was another guy who got caught on his way to do the same thing with 47 fire arms.

 

What is wrong with these people?

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How exactly are you coming to that figure? I'm not necessarily saying I disagree but I need to know what your factors are. They don't seem to jive with either my math or actual statistical data that is published.

 

http://chartsbin.com/view/1454

 

If you have something different, feel free to share. The data isn't that far off from the latest UN report on worldwide homicides.

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@Moal^^ already been posted and i agree.

 

 

 

I think there are too many variables to compare directly without acknowledging there are other factors and variables. Murder per 100' date='000 is pretty broad and not specific at all.

 

England is it's own island. US shares a border with violent mexican drug cartels and has massive drug problems across the whole nation. Guns are prevalent in the states and it is indeed typically more likely to be murdered by a gun than knife or whatever.

 

That's just two variables that aren't really accounted for off the top of my head and with bigger population numbers there are going to be more varying circumstances not factored in that might not paint the picture too accurately.[/quote']

 

You can twist data anyway you like to suit your needs. I'll use your reasoning though... how do you explain the US having higher murder rates than most of the Middle East?

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