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Question for boxing fans


Little_Kang

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I guess this can work with current mma now too.

 

I want to know what your guys expectations are for big name fights? Like what are you hoping to see whenever you see a Mayweather fight coming up or Pacquiao fight. I'm trying to understand where the lure is in boxing anymore. Like I saw the latest Pacquiao vs Bradley fight and to me it wasn't memorable.

Now when I actually paid attention to boxing was around Tyson/Jones jr/De LA hoya/etc era.

 

The only way I can think of it today is Glory. Like I hear the names Gohkan Saki/Tyrone Spong/Nieky Holzken and I just get giggity because they will put on a show. Like this last Glory lost all steam for me because holzken got injured

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But like what I see when I watch boxing is a lot of positioning and footwork then engagement. Like Tyson would come forward and slip punches before countering back. Same with rjj in his day

 

Yeah but Tyson and Roy were kind of an anomaly. Tyson because of his smaller size and peek-a-boo style clashed with the whole HW division. Jones had rediculous speed/reflexes and relied on head movement & power pot shoting with follow-up combos if he hurt someone. Both of them used footwork and superior positioning if they didn't just flatten an opponent outright.

 

It kind of seems to me there is sort of a established standardized set of styles across boxing now that makes it kind of predictable and bland. It also seems there are more point fighters than killers like in the 80's and before. It seems like the glory days of boxing had much more innovative fighters and styles even if only slight variations on standard methods.

 

Me personally i'm not to big on the big names anymore ( but i don't follow boxing as much anymore ) i just want interesting fights and fighters willing to go after the kill in unorthodox ways if the standard stuff isn't quite working.

 

With Kickboxing and MMA there are so many more tools and different kinds of style clashes that create far more interesting fights for the most part because everyone is really unique at least more so than boxing i feel.

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I'm much more interested in the tactics and strategy and how brilliant the fighters are at implementing difficult things and making it look easy.

 

Things like feints, angles, positioning, how a fighter is playing another fighter with timing & rhythm changes, using certain defensive maneuvers to shut down the more dangerous bread n butter weapons and the opponent's response to that or using defensive tactics to tire an opponent out early to take the steam out of them then crush or dominate them later.

 

Those are the kinds of things i try to pay attention to and it makes the fights even seemingly boring ones that much more interesting.

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But like what I see when I watch boxing is a lot of positioning and footwork then engagement. Like Tyson would come forward and slip punches before countering back. Same with rjj in his day

 

Yeah but Tyson and Roy were kind of an anomaly. Tyson because of his smaller size and peek-a-boo style clashed with the whole HW division. Jones had rediculous speed/reflexes and relied on head movement & power pot shoting with follow-up combos if he hurt someone. Both of them used footwork and superior positioning if they didn't just flatten an opponent outright.

 

It kind of seems to me there is sort of a established standardized set of styles across boxing now that makes it kind of predictable and bland. It also seems there are more point fighters than killers like in the 80's and before. It seems like the glory days of boxing had much more innovative fighters and styles even if only slight variations on standard methods.

 

Me personally i'm not to big on the big names anymore ( but i don't follow boxing as much anymore ) i just want interesting fights and fighters willing to go after the kill in unorthodox ways if the standard stuff isn't quite working.

 

With Kickboxing and MMA there are so many more tools and different kinds of style clashes that create far more interesting fights for the most part because everyone is really unique at least more so than boxing i feel.

 

But couldn't the same apply to mma these days now too. Like certain bread and butter things are all we seem to see with few exclusions. Like one example is wall walking. Top guy will always stay usually in full guard so the bottom guy can't scoot out and get to his knees to wall walk. Like there are few fighters that are trying to learn full/half guard sweeps to reverse the position over merely standing up.

 

I find that the golden age of mma is behind us as well where you could that unique style difference between fighters.

 

 

Kickboxing/bjj/sub wrestling seems to be the last shows of just one area of fighting that people truly let loose their styles. Where you can have those traditional technical styles of a Holzken that could match with the crazy style of a Raymond Daniels that using flash for some of the best knock outs I've seen. Where two greats, Saki and Spong, can clash and have such a varying style difference

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The lure is watching the best. The trouble with MMA is that the best athletes dont do MMA. `SO we end up watching the best of the rejects from major sports.

 

I said this 3 years ago, and the forum went crazy. I still compare it to track and field, the decathalon athletes are the best, but would get destroyed in the individual events.

 

But like what I see when I watch boxing is a lot of positioning and footwork then engagement. Like Tyson would come forward and slip punches before countering back. Same with rjj in his day

 

I get excited for the match ups. I still think the skill level is incredible, and enjoy watching incredible athletes compete against each other. That also goes for MMA.

 

 

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Big name fights are not the be all and end all, I love watching the local British events and trying to figure out who will make it to the world stage, for instance I tipped Groves from the start (Jungle fights etc) and then he put on a great performance against another of my favourites Carl Froch.

 

Furthermore, it is still the sweet science. No other martial art compares hands wise and the skill at the top level is unreal. We saw Pat Barry against a boxer at Glory I think? it did not end well for him.

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The lure is watching the best. The trouble with MMA is that the best athletes dont do MMA. `SO we end up watching the best of the rejects from major sports.

 

I said this 3 years ago, and the forum went crazy. I still compare it to track and field, the decathalon athletes are the best, but would get destroyed in the individual events.

 

But like what I see when I watch boxing is a lot of positioning and footwork then engagement. Like Tyson would come forward and slip punches before countering back. Same with rjj in his day

 

I get excited for the match ups. I still think the skill level is incredible, and enjoy watching incredible athletes compete against each other. That also goes for MMA.

 

 

Disagree about the decathlon. That is the consolation game played by all the kids who weren't good enough to compete in the other events.

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I guess this can work with current mma now too.

 

I want to know what your guys expectations are for big name fights? Like what are you hoping to see whenever you see a Mayweather fight coming up or Pacquiao fight. I'm trying to understand where the lure is in boxing anymore. Like I saw the latest Pacquiao vs Bradley fight and to me it wasn't memorable.

Now when I actually paid attention to boxing was around Tyson/Jones jr/De LA hoya/etc era.

 

The only way I can think of it today is Glory. Like I hear the names Gohkan Saki/Tyrone Spong/Nieky Holzken and I just get giggity because they will put on a show. Like this last Glory lost all steam for me because holzken got injured

 

Another little_kang K-1 recruiting thread :P :D

 

For me it holds a certain sentiment. My dad ordered a lot of the big boxing PPV's in the 90's and enjoy the history of the sport. My fandom slowly died out in the 2000's as I started watching more MMA and only got up for the big boxing fights but I don't know if it's the loss in stars in MMA or just that boxing seems to be building more stars but I've been watching a lot more up and coming boxers, not just bigs fights lately.

 

Me and my wife also plan to move out to Las Vegas in the next 10 years as well as we both love the city and boxing does and always will represent Vegas for me, not MMA. It just mirrors a lot of the glitz and glam of Vegas that I enjoy that the UFC doesn't really represent for me. I've been trying to get into Glory lately and I enjoy the fights but i think it's still finding it's niche for me.

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I guess this can work with current mma now too.

 

I want to know what your guys expectations are for big name fights? Like what are you hoping to see whenever you see a Mayweather fight coming up or Pacquiao fight. I'm trying to understand where the lure is in boxing anymore. Like I saw the latest Pacquiao vs Bradley fight and to me it wasn't memorable.

Now when I actually paid attention to boxing was around Tyson/Jones jr/De LA hoya/etc era.

 

The only way I can think of it today is Glory. Like I hear the names Gohkan Saki/Tyrone Spong/Nieky Holzken and I just get giggity because they will put on a show. Like this last Glory lost all steam for me because holzken got injured

 

Another little_kang K-1 recruiting thread :P :D

 

For me it holds a certain sentiment. My dad ordered a lot of the big boxing PPV's in the 90's and enjoy the history of the sport. My fandom slowly died out in the 2000's as I started watching more MMA and only got up for the big boxing fights but I don't know if it's the loss in stars in MMA or just that boxing seems to be building more stars but I've been watching a lot more up and coming boxers, not just bigs fights lately.

 

Me and my wife also plan to move out to Las Vegas in the next 10 years as well as we both love the city and boxing does and always will represent Vegas for me, not MMA. It just mirrors a lot of the glitz and glam of Vegas that I enjoy that the UFC doesn't really represent for me. I've been trying to get into Glory lately and I enjoy the fights but i think it's still finding it's niche for me.

 

Lol this isn't a recruiting thread. I just wanted to understand and the biggest part of your post was the first paragraph. My dad got me in to martial arts/boxing too. That's where I learned to love it all but when I started martial arts it was striking arts and I guess I always loved the stand up because I related to it more then anything despite having several years in bjj

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But like what I see when I watch boxing is a lot of positioning and footwork then engagement. Like Tyson would come forward and slip punches before countering back. Same with rjj in his day

 

Yeah but Tyson and Roy were kind of an anomaly. Tyson because of his smaller size and peek-a-boo style clashed with the whole HW division. Jones had rediculous speed/reflexes and relied on head movement & power pot shoting with follow-up combos if he hurt someone. Both of them used footwork and superior positioning if they didn't just flatten an opponent outright.

 

It kind of seems to me there is sort of a established standardized set of styles across boxing now that makes it kind of predictable and bland. It also seems there are more point fighters than killers like in the 80's and before. It seems like the glory days of boxing had much more innovative fighters and styles even if only slight variations on standard methods.

 

Me personally i'm not to big on the big names anymore ( but i don't follow boxing as much anymore ) i just want interesting fights and fighters willing to go after the kill in unorthodox ways if the standard stuff isn't quite working.

 

With Kickboxing and MMA there are so many more tools and different kinds of style clashes that create far more interesting fights for the most part because everyone is really unique at least more so than boxing i feel.

 

But couldn't the same apply to mma these days now too. Like certain bread and butter things are all we seem to see with few exclusions. Like one example is wall walking. Top guy will always stay usually in full guard so the bottom guy can't scoot out and get to his knees to wall walk. Like there are few fighters that are trying to learn full/half guard sweeps to reverse the position over merely standing up.

 

I find that the golden age of mma is behind us as well where you could that unique style difference between fighters.

 

 

Kickboxing/bjj/sub wrestling seems to be the last shows of just one area of fighting that people truly let loose their styles. Where you can have those traditional technical styles of a Holzken that could match with the crazy style of a Raymond Daniels that using flash for some of the best knock outs I've seen. Where two greats, Saki and Spong, can clash and have such a varying style difference

 

Wall walking is probably not the best example there. It's just a tactic of the environment. Like in kickboxing because of the ring and sharp angles of the corners people try to cut off the ring and trap people in the corners. What about leg kicks till a fighters legs are toast. That's a constant theme in kickboxing. Why is that? Because it's damn effective. Same for wall walking in MMA.

 

I think MMA is constantly evolving and while there is nothing really new under the sun technique wise we do see variations, different set-ups, different strategies & tactics and fighters giving their own unique personal twist to things. There are trends of course that will always be constant but there are new trends all the time that one fighter introduces as being really effective then suddenly it sweeps across like wild fire and everyone is doing it.

 

I see what you're saying about unique style differences kind of being a thing of the past in some ways but i still see there are fighters that have TMA backgrounds or willing to pick up and learn different styles other than the standard base 4 in Boxing, Thaiboxing, BJJ, Wrestling that everyone is really familiar with. Also everyone's own personal style is pretty unique.

 

Raymond Daniels is a boss btw. I remember watching him back in the day having highlight reel KO's on that Chuck Norris world combat league show on TV.

 

 

 

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Furthermore, it is still the sweet science. No other martial art compares hands wise and the skill at the top level is unreal. We saw Pat Barry against a boxer at Glory I think? it did not end well for him.

 

Pat is not a high level kickboxer though. He's like a small wild ape you turn lose in the ring and if an opponent can whether the storm and tap dat chin the ape goes night night.

 

I love Pat but his boxing, defense & strategy were never really beyond amateur level and frankly gotten worse. He's a small HW with a lot of power but he's always relied on hurricane offense as defense.

 

Zero footwork other than back peddle in a straight line, zero angles of attack....he just stands very square which limits his reach with his hands even more and he's always in centerline with the opponent never taking an angle and he comes straight forward like a bull again not using 45 degree angles to set-up attacks and stay safe from counters. He has zero head movement other than a level change and push off ( again no angles just linear and square ) As a smaller HW all of that should be his foundation but instead he chooses to be flat footed, block and throw leg kicks, occasional high kick and hurricane swarm punching. If that fails he gets picked apart and or KO'ed.

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