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pino111

Cecil People respond to fans

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This a**hole is even more retarded after this.

 

stuffing takedowns doesnt mean sh** either. If he countered with a takedown that would make sense. Shogun beat him to the clinch all but once. He reversed machida to his back on the cage almost every time.

 

As cofield pointed out about cecil saying body and leg kicks not finishing' date=' that is one of the most uneducated statements an mma official could ever make. Yes, finish percentages are higher with head strikes than body and below. However, not only can they stop fights, but they are very significant in wearing your opponent, especially in longer strenuous fights such as that one. [b']Machida was beat after that fight, and Shogun could of gone another 1, maybe 2 more rounds.[/b] Peoples is not helping his argument with this. Somebody please fire this moron.

 

Your quote in bold, is what everybody seems to be judging this fight on.

Sure, Machida was beat after the fight. He was also starting to wear down in the 4th and 5th rounds. Coincidentally, Shogun WON those two rounds. Had there been another 2 rounds, Shogun definitely would have won.

As I've said many, many, MANY times.. Shogun won the 'fight', but Machida won the first 3 rounds. Do that math on that.

 

For those of you crying about how 'bad' this decision is, go watch the Couture/Rizzo fight. Couture could barely walk at the end of that fight, yet walked away with the win. Machida wasn't hurt anywhere near as bad as Randy was.

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This guy is a complete ****. I literally disagreed with EVERYTHING this guy said. And then for him to have a go at fans by using the 'real fans understand' statement is just outrageous. Especially when i have not only dedicated about 8 years of my life training in martial arts, but also i have dedicated about 10 years watching mixed martial arts. Peoples is a complete ****. Everything he said was wrong i thought. He actually made out as if it was completely one sided. I bet for a fact that Lyoto Machida did not think he was controlling the pace. Did you not listen to his corner in between rounds... they were constantly telling him he has not found his ryhthm or his range yet. And telling him not to worry it will come. no joke... they said this to him going into the fifth round... that is not Octagon Control in my eyes. If the fighter has not yet found his range yet lol. I agree Machida did some things better than Shogun. But for Peoples to say that leg kicks dont finish a fight... that guy obviously knows nothing. Ask any kickboxer or muay thai fighter or in fact any MMA fighter, how devastating leg kicks can be.. and how they can potentially change the whole fight. And they can.. i have experienced it first hand.. obviously not on the same level. But still... once your legs are taken from you.. its very hard to compete at the same level. Now, im not saying that WON Shogun the fight, but it should be taken into consideration when scoring. And also MAchida was trying to finish the fight? Hmm i thought that was more Shogun, but ahwell.

 

This fight was close. And what he said just sounded stupid, IMO.

 

Anyway, we should forget about this now.. it happened, and we cant change it. The rematch is pretty much guarenteed in the near future. Concentrate on up coming events until the rematch lol.

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I love how everyone is saying Leg Kicks doesn't win fights, especially title fights. What excactly was it that really won the fight for Forrest over Rampage? ? ? ? ? ? thinking ........ thinking.....still thinking.......... OH YEAH LEG KICKS. Damage is done thus counting as effective striking.

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I love how everyone is saying Leg Kicks doesn't win fights' date=' especially title fights. What excactly was it that really won the fight for Forrest over Rampage? ? ? ? ? ? thinking ........ thinking.....still thinking.......... OH YEAH LEG KICKS. Damage is done thus counting as effective striking.[/quote']

 

Comparing the damage done to Rampage and the damage done to Machida is laughable. Rampage was in wayyyy more visible pain that Machida was. He was even DROPPED by the leg kicks.

People are grasping at straws trying to justify the win for Shogun. Why? Because while the vast majority of you guys picked Lyoto to win, you were really cheering for Shogun.

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Your quote in bold' date=' is what everybody seems to be judging this fight on.

Sure, Machida was beat after the fight. He was also starting to wear down in the 4th and 5th rounds. Coincidentally, Shogun WON those two rounds. Had there been another 2 rounds, Shogun definitely would have won.

As I've said many, many, MANY times.. Shogun won the 'fight', but Machida won the first 3 rounds. Do that math on that.

 

For those of you crying about how 'bad' this decision is, go watch the Couture/Rizzo fight. Couture could barely walk at the end of that fight, yet walked away with the win. Machida wasn't hurt anywhere near as bad as Randy was.[/quote']

 

I dont know what are you trying to prove when even you admit that Shogun won the fight. That is the only thing that matters not some points that Machida has from his phantom punches.

Shogun dominated Machida. Machida had nothing on him. I would gave Machida only third round and even that is debateble. But that doesnt even matter beacuse Machida was beaten after the fight while Shogun was fresh.

Can anyone tell me when they have ever seen someone win the fight after completly losing the last two rounds, while the other three being close at best. Thats right never, they just robbed Shogun plain and simple.

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Comparing the damage done to Rampage and the damage done to Machida is laughable. Rampage was in wayyyy more visible pain that Machida was. He was even DROPPED by the leg kicks.

People are grasping at straws trying to justify the win for Shogun. Why? Because while the vast majority of you guys picked Lyoto to win' date=' you were really cheering for Shogun.[/quote']

 

I'm not a fan of Shogun or any fighter for that matter really, i just enjoy MMA in general, i did pick him to win but doesn't matter to me either way, just not good for the sport to have this big of a controversy in a title fight, rematch or not.

 

So from what your saying is that just becasue Rampage couldn't "hide" the pain he was in makes it different? The fact is those legs kicks still count as EFFECTIVE STRIKING which is a criteria correct?

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I dont know what are you trying to prove when even you admit that Shogun won the fight. That is the only thing that matters not some points that Machida has from his phantom punches.

Shogun dominated Machida. Machida had nothing on him. I would gave Machida only third round and even that is debateble. But that doesnt even matter beacuse Machida was beaten after the fight while Shogun was fresh.

Can anyone tell me when they have ever seen someone win the fight after completly losing the last two rounds' date=' while the other three being close at best. Thats right never, they just robbed Shogun plain and simple.[/quote']

 

Whatever, man. You grasp at your straws. Everyone can admit that the first three rounds were close. But, while they were close, Lyoto won them.

You think that the fighter with the best cardio deserves to win just because he can continue to fight when it's over?

This is the exact kind of fight that Shogun would have won in Pride.

 

Yes, I admit that I think Shogun got the better of Machida. I've said that all along. He won the 'fight'. But, being a sport, these fights are contested in ROUNDS.

Under the system of scoring a fight by ROUNDS.. Machida wins because he won the first three rounds.

It sucks for Shogun, and it sucks for everyone who wanted to see him win.. but that's what this ultimately comes down to. MMA needs a new scoring system.

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I'm not a fan of Shogun or any fighter for that matter really' date=' i just enjoy MMA in general, i did pick him to win but doesn't matter to me either way, just not good for the sport to have this big of a controversy in a title fight, rematch or not.

 

So from what your saying is that just becasue Rampage couldn't "hide" the pain he was in makes it different? The fact is those legs kicks still count as EFFECTIVE STRIKING which is a criteria correct?[/quote']

 

I will agree with you on the fact that it's considered effective striking, but you have to keep in mind that the counters from Lyoto were also effective striking.

Rampage was almost completely unable to fight back at one point in his fight with Forrest, whereas Machida was still in the fight.

I'm not saying anything about 'hiding' the pain, because if you use that logic, than maybe Shogun was 'hiding' his pain better than Machida was.

What I'm saying, is that leg kicks, while effective, are not the main reason for Lyoto slowing down after the 3rd round. IMO, it was his cardio which was the main reason.. not the leg kicks.

Do you think that's a fair assessment?

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Whatever' date=' man. You grasp at your straws. Everyone can admit that the first three rounds were close. But, while they were close, Lyoto won them.

You think that the fighter with the best cardio deserves to win just because he can continue to fight when it's over?

This is the exact kind of fight that Shogun would have won in Pride.

 

Yes, I admit that I think Shogun got the better of Machida. I've said that all along. He won the 'fight'. But, being a sport, these fights are contested in ROUNDS.

Under the system of scoring a fight by ROUNDS.. Machida wins because he won the first three rounds.

It sucks for Shogun, and it sucks for everyone who wanted to see him win.. but that's what this ultimately comes down to. MMA needs a new scoring system.[/quote'] agree, they definitely need a better scoring system. I hate to admit it when comparing shogun to machida. shogun is a better fighter in a tiny margin and he should win. but I think machida did won the first 3 rounds based on Cecil scoring system .

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It seems some people just can't see reason.

 

Shogun won every round except the 1st in my mind.

 

I went into that fight wanting Machida to win and all I said the whole fight was "damn Machida is getting torn apart."

 

and I hate how running away from your opponent is now reffered to as "Octagon Control" give me a break.

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I will agree with you on the fact that it's considered effective striking' date=' but you have to keep in mind that the counters from Lyoto were also effective striking.

Rampage was almost completely unable to fight back at one point in his fight with Forrest, whereas Machida was still in the fight.

I'm not saying anything about 'hiding' the pain, because if you use that logic, than maybe Shogun was 'hiding' his pain better than Machida was.

[b']What I'm saying, is that leg kicks, while effective, are not the main reason for Lyoto slowing down after the 3rd round. IMO, it was his cardio which was the main reason.. not the leg kicks.[/b]Do you think that's a fair assessment?

 

i can agree to a certain extent but your arguement that i highlighted has holes. Its YOUR OPINION that that is not the reason he slowed down, WE don't know that it wasnt' the kicks that slowed him down. Again though, the leg kicks are considered effective striking and Shogun landed more, that should give that part of the fight to Shogun not Machida as Peoples claims.

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Whatever' date=' man. You grasp at your straws. Everyone can admit that the first three rounds were close. But, while they were close, Lyoto won them.

You think that the fighter with the best cardio deserves to win just because he can continue to fight when it's over?

This is the exact kind of fight that Shogun would have won in Pride.

 

Yes, I admit that I think Shogun got the better of Machida. I've said that all along. He won the 'fight'. But, being a sport, these fights are contested in ROUNDS.

Under the system of scoring a fight by ROUNDS.. Machida wins because he won the first three rounds.

It sucks for Shogun, and it sucks for everyone who wanted to see him win.. but that's what this ultimately comes down to. MMA needs a new scoring system.[/quote']

 

It wasnt cardio that was problem for Machida he was beaten up, bruised. Shogun outstruck Machida in every round, go check it at fightmetric. It wasnt just leg kicks he also landed more punches to the face. Just admit it already its geting redicioulus or buy a pair of glasses.

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It seems some people just can't see reason.

 

Shogun won every round except the 1st in my mind.

 

I went into that fight wanting Machida to win and all I said the whole fight was "damn Machida is getting torn apart."

 

and I hate how running away from your opponent is now reffered to as "Octagon Control" give me a break.

 

Exatcly the whole fight I was just "Machida is getting picked apart" And turning of the sound didnt help. I still saw Machida getting dominated.

Well you cant argue with some people they will rather go with their heads true the wall than admit that Shogun should have the belt.

Rematch is a slap in the Shoguns face.

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I actually agree with him 100%.

 

Machida won Octagon control and grappling' date=' something everyone is discounting. The only thing everyone is taking into account is how one fighter looked after the fight and how many punches and kicks they threw.[/quote']

 

but of course you de he is saying exactly what your Machida loving self wants to hear :)

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No. What he's saying is Machida determined when they would exchange. Rua never got a hold of Machida and never caught Machida against the cage and unloaded like Machida did to Rua. Machida decided where the striking battles took place.

 

Which is discounts all the strikes and damage Shogun did during those exchanges that Machida "let happen" and the ones Shogun dictated.

 

Cecil's response was just a cop-out. Much of his logic is flawed:

 

1. "When both fighters are engaged... I always look for is the fighter who is being judicious, picking his spots, being accurate and landing the cleaner strikes which ultimately is what Lyoto did more effectively than Rua.

 

The stats show Rua landing double the amount of strikes Machida landed - many of which were damaging power shots and not Machida's karate-style for-points karate blows.

 

2. "First of all what you need to understand is that from where the judges are sitting, we get to see things that the fans at home may miss."

 

I've been ringside at fights (not UFC) and often wished I could've seen the action birds-eye view through well-placed camera. There is much missed from ringside. To say he can see things fans can't see on TV is completely pointless without citing what he saw differently. Does Machida constantly backing up and trying to cover up his injured ribs and legs look that different in person vs. TV?

 

3. "Mauricio Rua was being aggressive but it wasn't effective aggressiveness...Lyoto was landing the more cleaner and damaging strikes t...clean strikes are valued more-so than the quantity of strikes landed."

 

The severe injuries Lyota sustained, the lack of movement from the 3rd round on and the strike stats completely tell another story. Rua outstruck Machida around 2-1 and landed more damaging blows. If a ringside judge doesn't believe those blows were damaging (let alone effective) then he has no business judging that fight. Plain as daylight, Rua landed more effectively in each round.

 

At what point do the many damaging strikes outweigh a few damaging strikes, champion or not?

 

4. "You have to keep in mind we always the favour the fighter who is trying to finish the fight, and leg kicks certainly don't do that."

 

Just wow! You've never seen leg kicks finish fights? And you're a judge? Leg kicks, especially over the course of several rounds, often completely change the course of a fight. All mobility (such as Machida's ability to fake, switch stances, and change rhythm) are effected through the legs. Where the legs go, the hips and the body go. This is MMA, why aren't leg blows important to Peoples?

 

5."...Rua did have a few takedown attempts...however Lyoto defended them all successfully which counts as effective grappling...ununsuccessful takedown attempts are not scored at all."

 

On another forum someone countered that a punch that is blocked doesn't count as a strike, does it score points as a block?

 

If Cecil can argue that a successful takedown defense counts as successful grappling, which I agree with up to a point, the act of aggression to initiate the takedown should count towards aggression points. In Lyoto's case, it should also count as ring control nullifying his "elusiveness". If he can't run away, you can hold him against the cage and knee him. Rua did that. The aggressive act shouldn't be a negative.

 

---

 

Overall, much of Peoples' reasoning is utterly flawed. He opened with a copout and tried to support it with the flawed logic that led to his scoring the way he did. That's why so many are in an uproar is he has such a flawed perception of MMA. Judging at ringside just puts him in a position to employ that flawed perception where it can do the most damage.

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Comparing the damage done to Rampage and the damage done to Machida is laughable. Rampage was in wayyyy more visible pain that Machida was. He was even DROPPED by the leg kicks.

 

And how Rampage performed in that fight should determine the outcome of this fight. Gotcha!

 

So much for your argument about everyone else grasping at straws.

 

 

>seXXXpac continued: What I'm saying, is that leg kicks, while effective, are not the main reason for Lyoto slowing down after the 3rd round. IMO, it was his cardio which was the main reason.. not the leg kicks. Do you think that's a fair assessment?

 

Machida's cornerman holding two 1lb bags of ice on his knees and thighs reveal a completely different... assessment. Ice bags aren't to counteract a lack of cardio.

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You should write a book Mr. Peoples...your insight really made my day fantastic...I went out and picked up mushrooms the whole day after I read it...I will keep in mind your scoring system next time I buy a PPV, so I don't get all worked up like this, having this weird dream about you tied up in a chair, a gallon of gas and a very rewarding last cigarette...

 

Honestly, it happened, and it won't change. I am a Shogun fan, but at least we got to see a great fight, we got to see Rua getting his respect back to the dismay of some ****s, and we will get to see a rematch, with a nice bit of background story and the possibility of an absolute epic ending.

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G, you're dead wrong broseph.

 

Machida won, it wasn't correct. I've broken this thing down dude, as a master fan of the sport, and in no way does Machida win. The absolute worst is 3-2 Rua, and by my final decision, it's 4-1 Rua.

 

 

 

That aside, Cecil Peoples is attrocious. He's proven it time and time again, and his logic is completely retarded. Terrible judge - stick to judging a sport nobody really cares about anymore.

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G' date=' you're dead wrong broseph.

 

Machida won, it wasn't correct. I've broken this thing down dude, as a master fan of the sport, and in no way does Machida win. The absolute worst is 3-2 Rua, and by my final decision, it's 4-1 Rua.

 

 

 

That aside, Cecil Peoples is attrocious. He's proven it time and time again, and his logic is completely retarded. Terrible judge - stick to judging a sport nobody really cares about anymore.[/quote']

I respect your opinion. The fight was close enough that I can see people thinking like you do. A lot sure do. But, I think Machida won the first three rounds.

It really was a boring fight. Neither one did all that much.

I just wish people (not you) would act a little more mature about it. On both sides.

Two warriors went to battle, and I respect both of them. But the fight over all sucked.

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I respect your opinion. The fight was close enough that I can see people thinking like you do. A lot sure do. But' date=' I think Machida won the first three rounds.

It really was a boring fight. Neither one did all that much.

I just wish people (not you) would act a little more mature about it. On both sides.

Two warriors went to battle, and I respect both of them. But the fight over all sucked.[/quote']

 

Fair enough. Personally, I though Machida ws boring because he did not fight like we're all used to. However, I found Shogun's performance extremely exciting as it was a return to form that fans knew would happen eventually. The guy is only 25, and people were writing him off from the sport. The only thing I would have liked to have seen more was Shogun get a little meaner and open up those hands. I think he showed Machida too much respect on the fists, and if he had pressed a couple of exchanges with the fists, I'd say he KOs Machida. Next time, mark my words! :)

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10-8 should be the standard score for a round with 10-9 saved for razor thin rounds and 10-7 for lobsided rounds.

By scoring rounds with a clear winner 10-8 like the last 2 rounds (Shogun) of the fight and scoring very close rounds 10-9 like the first 2 rounds (Machida) the scores better reflect the fight.

I would have had it 10-9,10-9,10-8,8-10,8-10 making it a draw.

 

I think the fact that Shogun was not expected, by many, to make it to rounds 4 and 5 and then won them both was fresh in peoples minds and really affected the judgement and the atmosphere of the crowd. Rogan's commentary also influenced the TV audience to believe Shogun was robbed.

 

He was robbed... It should have been a draw!

 

Awesome fight! Can't wait for the rematch.

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I respect your opinion. The fight was close enough that I can see people thinking like you do. A lot sure do. But' date=' I think Machida won the first three rounds.

It really was a boring fight. Neither one did all that much.

I just wish people (not you) would act a little more mature about it. On both sides.

Two warriors went to battle, and I respect both of them. But the fight over all sucked.[/quote']

 

Shogun won. And the fight was one of the best technical batles from two great fighters. It makes me wonder why do you even watch MMA if fights like this bore you. For random violence?

And its good thing that there have been so much response after the fight. At least maybe the UFC will start to think what kind of judges they have.

This last ufc really reminded me that its all about the money nowdays, and which fighter brings more money.

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Shogun won. And the fight was one of the best technical batles from two great fighters. It makes me wonder why do you even watch MMA if fights like this bore you. For random violence?

And its good thing that there have been so much response after the fight. At least maybe the UFC will start to think what kind of judges they have.

This last ufc really reminded me that its all about the money nowdays' date=' and which fighter brings more money.[/quote']

 

So uh, yeah, the UFC does not have any judges. None. They have no control over who judges, or refs a fight.

Technical? Ok. Sure thing. I have been watching MMA since way before it was "cool" to do so. That was not all that technical. Unless of course technical means trying to avoid any real contact. In fact, Machida had a couple times where he opened up. Shogun, not so much.

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Dude did you watch the same fight? Shogun was doing more of the stalking that fight' date=' and there was no grappling. Shogun won the clinch battle, the striking, went for takedowns and pushed the action for most of the fight. Machida would come out with a flurry once and a while and usually got hit as much as he land

 

Your arguement is kind of silly[/quote']

 

 

Say it aint so jjw not u too!!!!!!!! come on man!!!!

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And you are wrong' date=' Machida won. That is why he still has the belt.[/quote']

 

Because of a technicality. That being the judges have nowhere near enough mma knowledge. The only people who think Machida did enough to retain his belt are either too close to Machida to see straight or the judges involved.

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Dude did you watch the same fight? Shogun was doing more of the stalking that fight' date=' and there was no grappling. Shogun won the clinch battle, the striking, went for takedowns and pushed the action for most of the fight. Machida would come out with a flurry once and a while and usually got hit as much as he land

 

Your arguement is kind of silly[/quote']

 

 

Did you watch the fight? Shogon didnt' win the clinch battle! Roudn one Lyoto put him in a two thai clinchs and unloaded 8-10 knees on Shogun. How did Shogun win the clinch?

 

Shogun tried a handful of takedowns and they were all stuffed with ease.

 

Thus Shogun lost in grappling.

 

And you said it yourself, "Machida would come out with a flurry once and a while". ONLY Machida was trowing any flurry or combos. Shogun did not. And no, in the flurries Lyoto threw he landed more hits then he took.

 

Also... you claim Shogun gets points for pushing the action? Everyone presses the action against an elusive counter puncher. That doesn't mean they are controlling the pace of the fight or the Octagon. It means they are chasing and only getting contact when the other guy chooses.

 

 

and as a final comment. People that try to use the "Media" as a backing for their stance that Shogun won... get real. The Media in this day and age consists of a bunch of regular joes who run websites or blog sites. They are not educated in MMA or in the criteria for judging a fight.

 

Fightmetrics is a prime example. Their stats are NEVER accurate. Never have been.

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Fair enough. Personally' date=' I though Machida ws boring because he did not fight like we're all used to. However, I found Shogun's performance extremely exciting as it was a return to form that fans knew would happen eventually. The guy is only 25, and people were writing him off from the sport. The only thing I would have liked to have seen more was Shogun get a little meaner and open up those hands. I think he showed Machida too much respect on the fists, and if he had pressed a couple of exchanges with the fists, I'd say he KOs Machida. Next time, mark my words! :)[/quote']

 

 

are you high?! Shogun's performance was exciting because it was a return to form? And Machida's was boring because we didnt' see him fight like we are used to? Machida fought like he always does. as a counter puncher. Shogun... was NOTHING like his usual form. Usually he is aggressive and all out, throwing strikes like crazy. This fight Shogun fought like Machida fights. As a counter puncher being very very careful on his shots.

 

I'm not saying Shogun fought bad, he fought very well in fact... I am saying it's not very accurate to say it was a return to his usual form.

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Did you watch the fight? Shogon didnt' win the clinch battle! Roudn one Lyoto put him in a two thai clinchs and unloaded 8-10 knees on Shogun. How did Shogun win the clinch?

 

Shogun tried a handful of takedowns and they were all stuffed with ease.

 

Thus Shogun lost in grappling.

 

And you said it yourself' date=' "Machida would come out with a flurry once and a while". ONLY Machida was trowing any flurry or combos. Shogun did not. And no, in the flurries Lyoto threw he landed more hits then he took.

 

Also... you claim Shogun gets points for pushing the action? Everyone presses the action against an elusive counter puncher. That doesn't mean they are controlling the pace of the fight or the Octagon. It means they are chasing and only getting contact when the other guy chooses.

 

 

and as a final comment. People that try to use the "Media" as a backing for their stance that Shogun won... get real. The Media in this day and age consists of a bunch of regular joes who run websites or blog sites. They are not educated in MMA or in the criteria for judging a fight.

 

Fightmetrics is a prime example. Their stats are NEVER accurate. Never have been.[/quote']

 

Exactly.

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Exactly.

 

I don't understand how people can have an issue with this. It's not that hard to score a fight. Even when the guy I want to win loses I can still score it right 99% of the time. I really do think that A) people forget fights are scored in rounds, and B) that Roe Jogan greatly influenced the crowds opinion with his insanely biased commentary.

 

The only round in the Machida Shogun fight that was at all hard to score was the 2nd round. That round was CLOSE.

 

All the rest were easy. Lyoto won 1 and 3 handily. Ditto Shogun for rounds 4 and 5.

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I don't understand how people can have an issue with this. It's not that hard to score a fight. Even when the guy I want to win loses I can still score it right 99% of the time.

 

The only round in the Machida Shogun fight that was at all hard to score was the 2nd round. That round was CLOSE.

 

All the rest were easy. Lyoto won 1 and 3 handily. Ditto Shogun for rounds 4 and 5.

 

You are 100% right.

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Did you watch the fight? Shogon didnt' win the clinch battle! Roudn one Lyoto put him in a two thai clinchs and unloaded 8-10 knees on Shogun. How did Shogun win the clinch?

 

Shogun tried a handful of takedowns and they were all stuffed with ease.

 

Thus Shogun lost in grappling.

 

And you said it yourself' date=' "Machida would come out with a flurry once and a while". ONLY Machida was trowing any flurry or combos. Shogun did not. And no, in the flurries Lyoto threw he landed more hits then he took.

 

Also... you claim Shogun gets points for pushing the action? Everyone presses the action against an elusive counter puncher. That doesn't mean they are controlling the pace of the fight or the Octagon. It means they are chasing and only getting contact when the other guy chooses.

 

 

and as a final comment. People that try to use the "Media" as a backing for their stance that Shogun won... get real. The Media in this day and age consists of a bunch of regular joes who run websites or blog sites. They are not educated in MMA or in the criteria for judging a fight.

 

Fightmetrics is a prime example. Their stats are NEVER accurate. Never have been.[/quote']

 

Great post!

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I don't understand how people can have an issue with this. It's not that hard to score a fight. Even when the guy I want to win loses I can still score it right 99% of the time. I really do think that A) people forget fights are scored in rounds' date=' and B) that Roe Jogan greatly influenced the crowds opinion with his insanely biased commentary.

 

The only round in the Machida Shogun fight that was at all hard to score was the 2nd round. That round was CLOSE.

 

All the rest were easy. Lyoto won 1 and 3 handily. Ditto Shogun for rounds 4 and 5.[/quote']

will you quit saying rogan influenced peoples opinions? thats aggravating to me. he didnt have anything to do with it. people have 2 eyes and can see...and believe it or not we arent as stupid as you machida fans would like to think we are.

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And you are wrong' date=' Machida won. That is why he still has the belt.[/quote']

 

The only reason Machida "Won" is because these "judges" didn't want to be the ones responsible for giving him his first loss as well as taking his coveted title away from him in a very close fight...as close as it was 95% of the world all saw Shogun win...and Lyoto Machida was one of them!

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1. "When both fighters are engaged... I always look for is the fighter who is being judicious' date=' picking his spots, being accurate and landing the cleaner strikes which ultimately is what Lyoto did more effectively than Rua.

 

[b']Wrong. Rua was being just as judicious, picking his spots, being accurate and landed more clean strikes that also did way more damage. The only round this is even debatable is round 3 which Rua was winning at first but Machida came back and stole the round with a flurry which BTW were mostly blocked. Also maybe round 1 which was a draw in my eyes. Machida taking it early on them Rua coming back strong.[/b]

 

2. "First of all what you need to understand is that from where the judges are sitting, we get to see things that the fans at home may miss."

 

Utter garbage. I can see the fight better than he can and I can also watch the fight in slow mo on DVR also I have a better understanding of MMA in my left pinky alone compared to his whole body. I saw it three times and didn't miss a thing. Rua won round 2, 4 & 5 and maybe even round 1.

 

3. "Mauricio Rua was being aggressive but it wasn't effective aggressiveness...Lyoto was landing the more cleaner and damaging strikes t...clean strikes are valued more-so than the quantity of strikes landed."

 

Hahhhahahhha. Why was Machida stitching stances often and limping every time he was kicked in the leg. They both landed damaging strikes but Rua landed more frequently and did way more damage except maybe round 3 and 1 which was close. Rounds two, four and five were not even close.

 

4. "You have to keep in mind we always the favour the fighter who is trying to finish the fight, and leg kicks certainly don't do that."

 

This says it all right here. Let me kick Cecil just once to the leg or body and I promise it will end the fight. How was Rua not trying to finish? I've seen plenty of fights end with leg kicks and body kicks. Machida wouldn't give Rua his head so Rua attacked his body and legs and his strikes were more effective than Machida's for the majority of just about every round.

 

5."...Rua did have a few takedown attempts...however Lyoto defended them all successfully which counts as effective grappling...ununsuccessful takedown attempts are not scored at all."

 

I'll let this one slide but Rua did punish Machida's legs with knees and even landed some elbows on the breaks. His grappling set that up. Were all those knees to Machida's legs not effective aggression? It sure helped cripple Machida later in the fight when everything starting adding up. If anything grappling was a draw.

 

 

The main problem with the judging criteria is they separte striking from grappling when the two go hand and hand. If a fighter lands dozens of knees from a clinch it's not only effective striking but grappling as well. One sets up the other and Cecil and others just don't seem to understand this.

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And you are wrong' date=' Machida won. That is why he still has the belt.[/quote']

 

Not disputing that. Machida one. The judges just made a bad call. That is why he still has the belt.

 

Thus you are wrong.

 

We can go in circles with this if you'd like to continue. My posts gave my reasoning but you're just posting an opinion without any supporting logic.

 

You're stating things I didn't dispute.

 

Yes. The outcome of the match is that Machida one. Yes. Machida still has the belt.

 

I'd rather elevate the level of conversation, though.

 

or... we can stick to much simpler conversations like:

 

Water is wet. Ice is cold. Butterflies are pretty.

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FightMetric: 49-47 Rua

Yahoo Sports / Cagewriter: 48-47 Rua

BloodyElbow : 48-47 Rua

USAToday: 48-47 Rua' date=' 49-46 Rua

MMA Fanhouse / Michael David Smith: 48-47 Rua... Read More

MMATorch : 48-47 Rua

MMAJunkie : 49-46 or 48-47 Rua

MMAMania : 50-45 Rua

5 Ounces of Pain : Rua (no score given)

Fightlinker -- Rua (no score given)

ProMMA.Info: 50-45 Rua

Sherdog:

Jordan Breen scores the round 10-9 Rua (48-47 Rua)

Brian Knapp scores the round 10-9 Rua (48-47 Rua)

Mike Fridley scores the round 10-9 Rua (50-45 Rua)

 

this, alogn with the entire arena booing, dana white telling shogun he won the fight, several fighters saying shogun won the fight, lyotos lack of confidence behind his win saying that the judges made their decision and there is nothing he can do, and dana white giving shogun an immediate rematch should tell all the machida ****s that something was wrong with the decision, given the fact that cecil peoples was one of the judges, and he scored silva vs leites 48-47... i mean cmon guys, deal with reality here[/quote']

 

Spam this forum with this post one more time and I will ban you.

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The only reason Machida "Won" is because these "judges" didn't want to be the ones responsible for giving him his first loss as well as taking his coveted title away from him in a very close fight...as close as it was 95% of the world all saw Shogun win...and Lyoto Machida was one of them!

 

and to keep the bookies happy.

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Not disputing that. Machida one. The judges just made a bad call. That is why he still has the belt.

 

Thus you are wrong.

 

We can go in circles with this if you'd like to continue. My posts gave my reasoning but you're just posting an opinion without any supporting logic.

 

You're stating things I didn't dispute.

 

Yes. The outcome of the match is that Machida one. Yes. Machida still has the belt.

 

I'd rather elevate the level of conversation' date=' though.

 

or... we can stick to much simpler conversations like:

 

Water is wet. Ice is cold. Butterflies are pretty.[/quote']

 

Oh, so we are gonna get smart now? How about "won?" Not "one?" I mean, if we are gonna elevate the conversation and all.

Machida has the belt, he won.

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You are 100% right.

 

Do you not have any thoughts of your own? I may not agree with the guy you keep agreeing with, but I can have a conversation with him.

 

Add something. Anything.

 

Other than quote some dude a bunch of times with gems like "Exactly" and then post again "100% right" and then again and again.

 

Even if you disagree... just post some words and logic of your own.

 

By no means am I attacking you, just a polite request, friend.

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